posted
Hi everyone. I've been wanting to get into vinyl signmaking for a couple years. I finally purchased a Roland CX-24 about a month ago and I've been playing with it trying to learn the software (Vinyl Master Pro) and how to apply the vinyl. I've been reading a lot on this message board as well as several others and learn something new by the minute. I know what some of you are thinking, here's another one of those guys who sells stuff at a quarter of the price and produces inferior products, taking business away from someone else. Believe me, I don't want to be one of those guys. I'm not going to produce high quality work like the veterans here in the beginning, obviously. So here is my problem. Do I charge less because I'm new to this or do I charge what you would.
-------------------- Waylon Haven't decided on a name yet :) Bahamas gtcway@hotmail.com Posts: 7 | From: Bahamas | Registered: Jul 2003
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posted
you charge what you need to charge to get the job and make money on it.
do not use inferior(intermediate) products as a way to save time and money.
Get a Sign Contractors Pricing Guide and go by that and subtract 20% from what it says if you have a ton of local competition.
Letter your vehicle first, it's your best, cheapest advertisement of the work you do.
-------------------- -------------------- Dave Cox C2 Media Services (Formerly That Sign Guy) dave@c2mediaservices.com -------------------- Full Color Printing Posts: 295 | From: Sacramento CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Perhaps you think this is corny, but how about " 'Way Up High' signs"! (and I'll forward bank account details shortly for commissions on the success of the shop !lol ) Good luck!
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7018 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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how bout DA OH SIGNS......the old harry belafonte song BANANA BOAT....
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I'm practicing on intermediate vinyl, but I have begun to stock up on 3m and oracal cast vinyl for when I start to do stuff for the public. I don't have much competition but the main person doing signs where I live has been doing it for a long time. I just don't want to feel like I'm taking his business because I only charge half as much as he does. I want it to be because I do quality work and faster service.
posted
The first thing in getting into the sign business is to learn what makes a good sign. How you get there is the second step. Your vinyl operation is just a tool. Managing that tool can be difficult at times but just try to be a little bit smarter than the tool. Have you been in the business before vinyl? If so, you've got a great start. If not, look and learn what makes a great sign. The sign itself should dictate the price. The more efficent you produce it is how you make money. Love the work and hang in there. Tom
-------------------- Tom & Kathy Durham House Springs, MO Posts: 656 | From: House Springs, MO | Registered: Apr 1999
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Charge what you need to make a GOOD profit, and if you got the cajones, charge more than the other guy! At least nobody could accuse you of buying your work!
Starting off with lower pricing because of inexperience is just going to lock you into that mode.. If you want to get your name out there, do that *before* you officially open your doors to the public, and build your portfolio at the same time.
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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Starting off, I pinstriped EVERYTHING for anybody. This helps you get a straight eye, and a feel for color and design. If you lack in the design department, hire a part time designer to freelance and charge by the job. This you can pack into the price, and come out on top because your design was superior, and you can get more money for it! When you win by design and not by price, you can make great headway, and build reputation
""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3508 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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When I asked that question as an apprentice, an old journeyman told me to charge what he charged. When I said my work was not as good as his, he said that if I underbid him, I won't have him as a friend very long and if I charge more than I think I'm worth and want to give folks a fair shake, then that should motivate me to get better quickly. Many thanks for that lesson from Benedict the Sign Man...Corona Del Mar...1968
-------------------- The SignShop Mendocino, California
Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6847 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Waylon, get rid of the blues! Be happy! You are going into the sign biz, you'll have to be happy because you ain't gonna get rich
Three years ago I was in your shoes. DO NOT charge half what the other guy charges. You don't want to be the half A*# sign shop. You will really tick customers off when you decide that you are good enough to double the prices of their signs. Start off with your focus on good lay-out and quality materials. You will find your lay-outs improving day by day. Stay on board here and I'll guarantee you that in no time you will become addicted and start ordering 1-Shot and quills! The folks here are encouraging and helpful. Order Signcraft Magazine. If you are in love with signs you will enjoy it as well as learn from it. Also order the book "Mastering Layout" by Stevens. Allow it to be your second Bible, learning something from it every day.
BTW I'm an old Maw Maw and I wasn't a spring chicken 3 yrs. ago either! If I can do it so can you.
Welcome to Letterville and hang in there, the ride will be rough but exciting.
-------------------- Kathy Joiner River Road Graphics 41628 River Road Ponchatoula, La.70454
Old enough to know better...Too young to resist. Posts: 1891 | From: Ponchatoula, LA | Registered: Nov 2000
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-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
posted
Thanks everyone for the words of encouragement. I looking forward to getting an airbrush and quills to start practicing. Does anyone have any recommendations on a book or video on airbrushing?
Thanks.
-------------------- Waylon Haven't decided on a name yet :) Bahamas gtcway@hotmail.com Posts: 7 | From: Bahamas | Registered: Jul 2003
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Here are 3 titles of books I think that will help you.
1 The Complete Airbrush Book Author..S.Ralph Maurello It is full of instructions on how to and techiques.
2 How to make money with your Airbrush Author..Joseph Sanchez More on how to apply your work and sell it then how to Airbrush.. But still worth its weight in gold.
3 SpeedBall Pen and Ink Author unknown to me Great for basic set up in lettering and shows you how to do the strokes with a quill.. A great starting tool.
Hope this helps!
[ July 05, 2003, 07:00 AM: Message edited by: Stephen Deveau ]
-------------------- Stephen Deveau RavenGraphics Insinx Digital Displays
Letting Your Imagination Run Wild! Posts: 4327 | From: Lower Sackville, Nova Scotia, Canada | Registered: Jan 2000
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I understnad the frustration with learning and pricing on jobs, that you know, after the execution, could have been done better. In these situations, if it helps you sleep better at night, you can explain to the customer that you're still learning and offer them a slight discount. You'll find that in no time flat, you'll have your techniques down pact. Eating is a kewl thing. LOL
Keep your chin up and integrity in your dealings with your clients. This can be difficult as not all clients have integrity and love to push others around.
posted
Waylon, Welcome to Letterville! I agree with Kathy...Mike Stevens book, Mastering Layout is a must. You can order it here...just click this link: web page
You will find Pricing Guides, Mastering Layout by Mike Stevens,Vinyl graphics How To,Alphabet Books,Atkinson SignPainting, and lots of other books. Also you will find a wealth of information by clicking the Resource Center link on the left. I think attending a Letterhead Meet is another way to learn tips and gain knowledge. Hope to see you at the next Dixie Letterhead Meet.There are all sorts of letterhead meets going on around the world,but since you are in the Bahamas perhaps the next Dixie meet might be closer for you. Good Luck! Judy
-------------------- Judy Pate Signs By Judy Albany, Georgia USA 229-435-6824
Live simply...Love generously...Care deeply...Speak kindly...Leave the rest to God. Posts: 2629 | From: Albany,GA,USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
on pricing... stuff we taught apprentices in our shop
1/ start as you mean to go on... good advice from my granny, who explaned that if you start anything new doing your very best then your best can only get better!
2/ don't charge on houly rate... what is the adverage price for a 6'x4' sign in your area? to begin with that sign will take you 3 times longer to create than the experianced bloke, eventually it will take you the same amount of time and you won't have devalued the industry in the mean time. you will be driving yourself to get quicker so that it means more money in your pocket!
3/ don't apoligise for who you are... everyone has to start somewhere, don't get conned into thinking you deserve less because you are new to the industry, i was a barmaid at one point, devo was a truckdriver,the local bloke was a rigger, we all came from somewhere else or did something else for a time. life changes you just as any experiance will, you are what you believe you are and so others will believe it too. even legends make mistakes!
4/ learn everyday... read everything you can, ask as many questions as you can think of, go to letterhead meets and watch, buy the best referance material just as you buy the best tools, you will need it all to be able to, not only make a living, but a good living doing what you will love to do!
5/ get a signature..... make up a quote form, deposit receipt, and an artwork authorisation form, get a signature on each in that order. don't ever forget that the job isn't finished untill you write the invoice, and that nothing leaves your hands untill you have the money!
6/ have fun!
goodluck
cheers gail
[ July 06, 2003, 11:28 PM: Message edited by: Gail & Dave Beattie ]
-------------------- Gail & Dave Hervey Bay Qld Australia
gail@roadwarriorproducts.com.au
sumtimes ya just gota! Posts: 794 | From: 552 O'Regans Creek Rd Toogoom Qld 4655 Australia | Registered: Nov 1998
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DrCAS Custom Lettering and Design Saint Cloud, Minnesota
"Things work out best for the people who make the best of the way things work out." - Art Linkletter Posts: 6469 | From: Saint Cloud, Minnesota | Registered: Jun 1999
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