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I've got a small box truck to do in vinyl. This thing is ate up with rivits. The rows are centered on 16" the rivits are centered on 2"!!!!! It's got pretty extensive copy, most of it in pretty thin lettering. I figured the best and easiest way to do this one would be letter a 4x9 sheet of aluminum and attach it to the box. Here's where I need some advice. I'm sure somebody out there has done something like this. I was figuring on drilling and screwing into the rivit heads. Am I barking up the wrong tree here?
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
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Remove them if they have slots for a driver. Remove them only in the place you apply vinyl.
No slots? Other wise use a good cast vinyl and use some light heat around each rivet. Teh good vinyl will shrink back slightly and form around the head. Do it dry.. Wet around rivets is an endless pain.
-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5278 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
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If you are going to pop rivet it on be sure and use stainless steel rivets.
-------------------- Jimmy Chatham Chatham Signs 468 stark st Commerce, Ga 30529 Posts: 1766 | From: Commerce, GA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I would never attempt it that way. Jusy apply over those rivets like they aren't even there and then go back with a propane torch and burn them down. I'd use some A8 or 3M on rivets though. I'd also apply some fuzzy end of some velcrow to one edge of your squegee. Use this fuzzy side of the squegee while going over the rivets. It will create less friction and cause the squegee to glide over the rivets more easily.
[ May 27, 2003, 05:25 PM: Message edited by: Bruce Evans ]
-------------------- Bruce Evans Crown Graphics Chino, CA graphics@westcoach.net Posts: 913 | From: Chino, CA | Registered: Nov 1998
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George...Knowing what you do best..PAINT IT!
Or do what yer thinking but just screw the panel to the box and forget about trying to locate the rivits. When was the last time you tried to center a drill bit on a domed rivit?
I'd do it over the rivits myself...Using half or a quarter squeeegie so ya don't bump into the rivit "next door". I prefer cheap ones for that..they are kinda waxy and don't scratch the vinyl.
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
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Dave, good point about centering on the domed rivit, but if you screw it down directly to the truck it's gonna distort like crazy, maybe I can figure out the spacing and location of the holes, drill the sign and then silicone some spacers on the backside. There is absolutley no way I would attempt to paint OR apply 3" letters on the sides of this thing. I've never seen a truck with this many rivits.
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
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About 20 years ago, SignCraft had a cartoon by Bob Parsons on a similar subject--corrugations. His answer was to get a hammer and pound them all down flat. He said it was still a drag to letter but you felt so much better!
-------------------- David Harding A Sign of Excellence Carrollton, TX Posts: 5114 | From: Carrollton, TX, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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paint it geo.....simplest way round the problem!!!! my #8 quill is the best rivit brush i ever seen!!!!!!! if you must vinyl....wash the rivits with a good brush and wipe each one with A/E reducer. main thing with rivits if they aint clean vinyl wont stick!!!!
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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If the layout would fit on a 4x8' or less panel, then I would go with .080 alum with baked enamel finish, then screw that to truck every foot or so using self tapping screws. You could put something like a black faucet washer behind it. or they sell other rummer-grommet looking things in the hardware section that has stuff for chair legs........maybe they're called bumpers. Be sure to put your screws along the same lines as the rivets. but not in them (vertically). I think I used the rubber spacers to get the sign off the rivets because without them things could get noisy inside the truck with the sign vibrating in the breeze................
I have put aluminum on trailers before using .063 or .040, but then later always wished I had used the heavier .080......the other stuff always has a wavy look showing or just plain looks floppy.
-------------------- Jeff Ogden 8727 NE 68 Terr. Gainesville FL, 32609 Posts: 2138 | From: 8827 NE 68 Terr Gainesville Fl 32609 | Registered: Aug 2002
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George, On a good warm day in the sun?.....vinyl it Cool day in the shade?....paint it
Use HP cast vinyl. Center the squeegee over each rivet as you work down and press down firmly. Go back with a pin and put several holes around each rivet. Use a rivet brush, squeegee or torpedo tool to conform the vinyl to the sides of the rivet. Hit each one with a heat gun or propane torch...but don't torch it too close or too long.
But, I would probably rather mask and paint it.
-------------------- Wayne Webb Webb Signworks Chipley, FL 850.638.9329 wayne@webbsignworks.com Posts: 7409 | From: Chipley,Florida,United States | Registered: Oct 1999
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Thanks guys. This is not a done neal, I'm gonna hit them with a price that I hope runs them off.
I think a lot of you are missing the point about doing the lettering on a 4x8 panel. Being less of a hassle is one but it's more for legibility.There are just too many rivits involved here and to much copy with letters in a lightweight typestyle for it to look good either painetd or vinyl going over the rivits
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
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Are the rivets painted the same color of the panels? If they are, vinyl or paint is the best way to go, if the rivets are not painted with as many as you are talking and if if the stroke is that thin (1/4"-3/4" thick) you might have a legibility problem, then a panel might be the answer, or maybe a Scotchprint panel.
-------------------- Rick Chavez Hemet, CA Posts: 1540 | From: Hemet,CA U.S.A. | Registered: Jun 2001
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hell yea ,screwit on george...mayby after you get a couple in it you can take a snall ball peen and tap where the rivetds are to locate them for drilli ng then screw er on ...hip
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I'm with Jeff - heavier gague panel so it won't dimple on you George. I'd probably spec it for 3mil Dibond (just under $100/sheet in these parts), and put spacers under it. It will stay amazingly flat. In the end, the truth is that after 20,000 unwashed miles and a few trips down narow, tree lined alleys, nobody is even going to care if you used .030 alum and its dimpled to hell. It'll only bother you. Give 'em the option and take their money.
SONGPAINTER Original Sign Music by Sign People NOW AVAILABLE on CD and the proceeds go to Letterville's favorite charity! Click Here for Sound Clips! Posts: 1974 | From: Orleans, MA, Cape Cod, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Dibond is a good alternative, George, but I don't think that film installataion on corregation and rivets can easily be explained verbally. Both Rosemary and Latigo grew up in this industry and I've not seen anyone who can handle massive appliques on rivets with corregation like those two. I mean 9'x60' trailers, full coverage. An hour or two with them would send you on your way ready to do it, but I don't believe I could easily talk you through it. Want ticket info to Kalispell? heh...........
k31
-------------------- Pierre St.Marie Stmariegraphics Kalispell,Mt www.stmariegraphics.com ------------------ Plan on knowing everything before I die and time's running out! Posts: 4223 | From: Kalispell,Mt 59903 | Registered: Mar 2000
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Actually I found a smaller one (relatively) the kids did with rivets and corregation, and in a perfectly registered two color overlay. Try THAT one. heh........
-------------------- Pierre St.Marie Stmariegraphics Kalispell,Mt www.stmariegraphics.com ------------------ Plan on knowing everything before I die and time's running out! Posts: 4223 | From: Kalispell,Mt 59903 | Registered: Mar 2000
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George, use the 3M COMPLY vinyl! Ask for the one with the "grid pattern". This is the greatest stuff since oxygen! It must be applied DRY. It isn't available in too many colors, but it is the cat's @$$! Trust me. You will be amazed. You'll be looking for more rivets to attack, before you are done. Unbeleivable product. It costs a little more, but worth it's weight in gold! Good luck.
-------------------- Luke S. Luke Scanlan Artistry Ocala, Fl. lukescanlan@cox.net Posts: 249 | From: Ocala, Florida | Registered: Nov 2001
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