posted
I know this topic has been touched on before.
Does anyone recommend a paint mask film for use on back-sprayed plastic that is consistent about not leaving adhesive residue. Gerbermask is very bad about this and we want an alternative.
The Fellers catalog lists Oracal and Avery, as well as Fellers' house brand, Pask. Has anyone used these for Grip Flex with no glue problem?
Brad in Kansas City
-------------------- Brad Ferguson See More Signs 7931 Wornall Rd Kansas City, MO 64111 signbrad@yahoo.com 816-739-7316 Posts: 1230 | From: Kansas City, MO, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
When I worked at Coffelts in Emporia thats all they used ....Grip flex....its water base... spray with low psi..... they have the pink or the blue .....build up the layers then cut .....never seen a problem .........just my 2 cents
posted
We have used the Avery white paint mask on our one shot painted hdu signs. We route thru the paint mask, pull off the mask after we have primed/painted/goldleaf the sign. We never had any trouble with the paint pulling up or paint leaking under it. You can also cut it on your vinyl cutter.
Diane
-------------------- Balch Signs 1045 Raymond Rd Malta, NY 12020 518 885-9899 signs@balchsigns.com http://www.balchsigns.com Posts: 1695 | From: MaltaNY | Registered: Jan 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
I have used Grip-Flex on hundreds of signs over my 55 years of sign manufacturing experience all hand cut. Never a problem, great product if used as instructed!
-------------------- Len Mort Signmaker1.com 11 Juniper Drive Millbury, MA 508-865-2382 "A Good Business Sign, is A Sign of Good Business"(1957) Posts: 811 | From: Millbury, Ma | Registered: Dec 2006
| IP: Logged |
I agree that Grip Mask works great when hand cutting. I have never had a problem when using it. However, at least for us, it is impractical to hand cut all our mask for spraying plastic.
The problem we have only occurs when we make a computer-cut paint mask. The vinyl mask leaves glue behind when we pull it off after painting. But it only happens with Grip Flex paints.
-------------------- Brad Ferguson See More Signs 7931 Wornall Rd Kansas City, MO 64111 signbrad@yahoo.com 816-739-7316 Posts: 1230 | From: Kansas City, MO, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
Either the paint or the reducer is too hot for the vinyl and is burning through to the adhesive, I think the vinyl in paint masks is somewhat porous. I've had this happen with some automotive paints. Could there be a problem in application ( too heavy ) that might be contributing. I know this stuff is usually "dusted" on but I have seen guys lay it on heavy. Does the problem show up right away after application of the first color?
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
posted
I know there must be many sign people out there spraying GripFlex on top of a vinyl mask. I hope some more comments are forthcoming, especially from those who are having no problems at all with a mask leaving residue on plastic faces. I hate re-inventing wheels.
Today we tried a new paint mask. We tried to get Avery per Duncan's suggestion, but went with another brand that was in stock in Kansas City, the house brand that Fellers sells. It's called Pask (anybody know who makes it?). It's advertised as "no residue" and it was definitely an improvement over Gerbermask. It still left glue behind, but mostly where it overlapped Scotchcal 50, which we use only for black on back-lit signs. On the translucent vinyl colors the residue was minimal. Of course, Scotchcal 50 has a much higher gloss than the translucents, which are satiny in finish, making the translucents less likely to hang onto the masking adhesive, I suppose. The Pask film left no residue at all on the bare plastic. And if we switch to translucent for our black instead of Scorchcal 50, Pask may even leave less glue behind.
George made a couple of good points. I believe hot solvents do penetrate vinyls. I remember how soft and stretchy vinyl used to get when I sprayed it with Krylon years ago. Surely it can loosen the adhesive. When I worked for a company that did nothing but eradications on Cooley fabric, I was told that Gerbermask, as well as other low-tack paint masking vinyls, would leave glue residue behind after eradicating, their eradication fluid of choice being straight acetone, which they bought in fives. They switched to using an intermediate vinyl (Neschen) for masking and the problem went away. The only caveat was they had to peel the mask immediately after eradicating else it wanted to stick too well.
George also mentioned how some painters lay paint on heavy when they spray GripFlex. I tend to do this. I don't necessarily lay on heavy coats. Rather, I lay on many coats, more than most guys I've talked to. And I use more clear in my paint than most people. By using a good amount of clear and building up the color over more coats, I've been able to produce some good looking dark backgrounds that rivaled translucent vinyl. But if the extra paint, with it's extra load of reducer, is part of the problem, I may have to change my habit. I used clear in the beginning out of fear of splotchiness (bad spray technique?), then used it more and more when I realized I could turn out some strikingly brilliant greens on BP signs.
I admit I have been called heavy handed with a spray gun. Nobody likes to use the gun I prefer because it has a 2.0 mm tip on it — I could put out fires with it if I weren't spraying solvents — but I can spray large panels in a very short time. My spray pattern is huge so I rarely get tiger stripes. The trade-off is that I am also the leader in sags and runs. For me to spray something lightly, like a plastic face, takes great self-control.
-------------------- Brad Ferguson See More Signs 7931 Wornall Rd Kansas City, MO 64111 signbrad@yahoo.com 816-739-7316 Posts: 1230 | From: Kansas City, MO, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
Brad, the problem I had recently involved Pask, which I had never had a problem with before. I had put down a solid color, then pulled some of the mask up. I then took that same solid color and cut it with a clear and sprayed it over the solid and the base coat. I went at it heavier than with the base color. The result was a friggin mess, adhesive everywhere. I wiped everything off, repeated the process except where I used the clear, instead using an airbrush to lightly fog the color on. No problem. You might try leaving the clear out. I never figured out if my problem came from the clear itself, the fact that it was reduced more or that I laid it on heavier. I used to spray plastic faces years ago and know full well what a pain they are.
[ June 29, 2012, 08:01 AM: Message edited by: George Perkins ]
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
posted
transfer tape is the cheapest masking you can have on gripflex, I have done it and it works
-------------------- You ever notice how easily accessible people are when they are requiring your services but once they get invoice you can't reach them anymore
Printer-friendly view of this topic