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Do you believe in it? I really wanted to make it to Brian's Meet in Moncton, I really Did.. but it seems every Aug. over the last few years we can't seem to get anywhere, for various reasons, and we always used to be able to get away In August.
Even if our Customer service Girl, never left us for greener Pastures In Galgary... Even if Sickness on my side of the family never materialized, Even if Death, and sickness on my wife's side, her Cousin, who she was really close to, finally passed away from Breast Cancer on the Early Saturday of the meet, we still would'nt have made it.. A hurricane passed over here on the night before and on the very day we were suppose to leave on Motorcycle, dropping 150mm of rain making the road to the ferry impassable..and transportation impossible those 2 days, a lot of damage to roads. So Fate stepped in and made our decisions for us.
Maybe next time.. Maybe next time...
-------------------- "Keep Positive"
SIGNS1st. Neil Butler Paradise, NF Posts: 6277 | From: St. John's NF Canada | Registered: Mar 1999
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Sorry for the loss that your family has experienced, Neil.
With regard to your question, I have never believed in fate. If fate controlled our lives, why wear a seatbelt, or why watch your diet? What a mess it would be if all the criminals thought they didn't deserve punishment because they were victims of fate.
Time and unforseen events are the order of the day, and sometimes it's fun just to wait and see what happens next.
""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3485 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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Neil - go rent the Mothman Prophesies movie....
I generally don't believe in "fate" as an abstract law of nature....but this movie is supposedly based on real events and it'll send a chill up your spine for sure.
-------------------- Todd Gill Outside The Lines Potterville, MI Posts: 7792 | From: Potterville, MI | Registered: Dec 2001
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I really don't believe in Fate as well,, but sometimes?.. I don't believe the saying that when your numbers up, it's up. I believe there's things we can all do to change direction or the consequences.
-------------------- "Keep Positive"
SIGNS1st. Neil Butler Paradise, NF Posts: 6277 | From: St. John's NF Canada | Registered: Mar 1999
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Fate takes away the idea that we have freedom of choice and I just can't seem to grasp the idea that we have no control over who and what we are. It makes for a good excuse because something else is controlling us rather than ourselves. That way it's never our fault.
In my opinion, the greatest gift we have is the free will to make choices. It's not what happens to us that determines our outcome, it's our choice of how to react to those things that happen to us. Sail boats travel in all directions, but the wind only blows in one direction.
End of sermon.
-------------------- Chapman Sign Studio Temple, Texas chapmanstudio@sbcglobal.net Posts: 6306 | From: Temple, Texas, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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-------------------- Jon Aston MARKETING PARTNERS "Strategy, Marketing and Business Development" Tel 705-719-9209 Posts: 1724 | From: Barrie, ON, CANADA | Registered: Sep 2000
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...And sorry to read of your loss and other troubles, Neil.
-------------------- Jon Aston MARKETING PARTNERS "Strategy, Marketing and Business Development" Tel 705-719-9209 Posts: 1724 | From: Barrie, ON, CANADA | Registered: Sep 2000
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...We do have freedom of choice. And every choice we make is always the 'correct' one, even if it seems not to be at the time. I have come to believe that everything in our lives is predestined, and there is NO avoiding any thing that ever is going to happen to us. Some would call it "god's will".
posted
it's not a scripted movie, life's full of ad-libbing, out takes and "bloopers" ... & nothing ends up on the cutting room floor, if there is a "director" and their degree of influence or authority is one of humanities greatest mysteries...
...but it may be a tape loop, replaying through eternity, and all those free choices were already made, the consequences realized & the outcomes fixed... but never revealed or remembered by the participants.
posted
I would agree with you Raymond. It's all about free will. From the first human couple all the way down to our day.....it's a matter of choice. Nothing is predestined. Sorry WR.
""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3485 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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Our subconscious predetermines all our actions because that's where the true feelings lay, and all actions are a result of our true feelings.
"Free will" is just the conscious mind's perception of how things appear to be. We only *think* we're driving the train, yet the train is already on a set track.
And I really need to lay off the self hypnosis books...
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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One thing that I do believe, is that it's entirely possible to be in the wrong place, at the wrong time.....in spite of making all of what one perceives to be the "right choices." People who just happened to schedule some business at the World Trade Centre the day it was destroyed would be a prime example. Did they somehow make a bad or wrong choice? Fate might have it that they did, but even with the best of intentions, somehow their conscious decision ultimately proved out to be the wrong one. If one subscribes to the theory that their "choice" somehow influenced their demise. then I'd have a tough time in accepting that premise.
There is such a thing as being an innocent bystander.
-------------------- Ken Henry Henry & Henry Signs London, Ontario Canada (519) 439-1881 e-mail: kjmlhenry@rogers.com
Why do I get all those on-line offers to sell me Viagara, when the only thing hardening is my arteries ? Posts: 2684 | From: London,Ontario, Canada | Registered: Feb 1999
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Things happen to people... both good and bad which are far from being in our control. Illness, accidents... meeting people who have a big influence on our lives.
That's what makes like exciting.
That doesn't mean I simply sit and wait for life to happen or don't make plans however. Not at all. Life is about making choices... deliberate choices. The choices and decisions we make daily have a profound effect on our lives and on the lives of those around us in the immediate future and for years to come in my view.
We are who we choose to be, although circumstances may dictate just how far we travel or accomplish.
Those who achieve much do it in spite of what happens around them and not because of it.
I'm not so worried about how long I may live... but rather how much I fit into the life I am given.
Being whom I choose to be in Yarrow...
-grampa dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8738 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
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Being in the wrong place at the wrong time is not the result of fate or some predetermined plan, although many do find such circumstance.
Not all decisions result in favorable outcomes, no matter what we thought beforehand.
Ken's examples of the World Trade Center does not disprove the idea of free will of choice. Everyone of those unfortunate folks made the decision to be there that morning...of course, not knowing what was about to happen. Certainly, they were in the wrong place at the wrong time, but I don't think there was some universal plan (fate) that put them there. They simply chose to be there and became a part of a tragic part of history.
I don't know what any of this has to do with signs, but it is interesting, nonetheless.
-------------------- Chapman Sign Studio Temple, Texas chapmanstudio@sbcglobal.net Posts: 6306 | From: Temple, Texas, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I am amazed at the differing opinions, yet everyone has good points. There is a lot of life that is predetermined by a mind set. Goals lead to accomplishments. Yet sometimes fate does step in and change your course. Not neccessarily negatively, and not perhaps due to what you are doing, but perhaps what someone else has done affects your course.
What I do know is this, I wish I wasn't quite so superstitious. I wish I didn't believe in a lot of the garble-de-gunk that I do. It would probably make my life a lot easier.
-------------------- Deri Russell Wildwood Signs Hanover, Ontario
You're just jealous 'cause the little voices only talk to me. Posts: 1904 | From: Hanover, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Dec 1998
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I think life is like a large swiftly moving river, and we are out dog-paddling in it. As you are pushed downstream by the current you can paddle back and forth to the side to avoid obstacles or debri, but it's not easy...
The only thing you can do is continue down the river. Trying to swim forward only increases your pace by a small percentage. You can forget about trying to swim back upstream.
Eventually it begins to widen out, giving a lot more room for moving from one side to the other, but you can't really get too far from the main course.
If you decide to you want to change the entire course of the stream... you have to climb out, take your shovel and start digging a trench toward the ocean. It's a lot of work for most... but some people, like Dan, have a giant trencher like this one that can carve out wiggly lines that can be seen from orbit...
Either way, it's not easy to get out of the mainstream and head cross-country, especially if you are only operating with a garden hoe and a post hole digger, like myself. It's a lot easier to just drift along, and maybe get lucky and take a side stream someone else has dug, hoping it doesn't dead-end halfway to the ocean.
(Notice from the graphic that I've swum up a dead-end stream that seems to be infested with alligators)
Every now and then a swimmer gets hammered when a barge runs them over or an 18-wheeler flies off a bridge while they are passing underneath. A little more paddling at the right time might could have prevented being in close proximity to the incident, but there was no way to know that ahead of time.
Moral of the story: Fate doesn't control your life, you do. However, most major changes in course don't just happen but require a lot of work, determination and some knowledge. Every now and then good or bad things happen, but like Ray said, it's mostly just being in the wrong place at the right time, or the right place at the right time.
/wow, that was deep, you know, like a river //anyone know where I could get a pair of swim fins? ///a speedboat would be even better
[ August 16, 2007, 11:39 AM: Message edited by: Jon Jantz ]
-------------------- Jon Jantz Snappysign.com jjantz21@gmail.com http://www.allcw.com Posts: 3395 | From: Atmore, AL | Registered: Nov 2005
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I would have expected that, being in the sign business, more of us would be subscribing to the 'chaos theory'. It certainly seems prevalent in my shop!
-------------------- Graham Parsons Signs 'n Such Ltd Swift Current Saskatchewan Canada. www.signsnsuch.com
"Saskatchewan - hard to pronounce, easy to draw" Posts: 710 | From: Saskatchewan, Canada | Registered: Oct 1999
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let's see... in a nutshell for me ..there are no coincidences. i believe that we are balls of energy in human suits and fate brings people and situations together. of course there's so much more but i couldn't even begin to put it in words...so i won't even try. great discussion though.
-------------------- Karyn Bush Simply Not Ordinary, LLC Bartlett, NH 603-383-9955 www.snosigns.com info@snosigns.com Posts: 3516 | From: Bartlett, NH USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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I believe you and your reality are manifested from your thoughts.
You are, and you live what you think.
If you think your life sucks, well.. hello misery.
If you look at life as a gift, and face challenges as opportunities to learn and grow with anticipation and a smile on your face, it can make molehills out of mountains.
Posts: 12 | From: Red Deer Alberta | Registered: May 2007
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