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Sometime next year, Im considering building a shop to work in. I presently rent, and the landlord wont do anything to help the building stay up to date. That and the part of town Im in, is becoming very seedy, and its on one of the main drags. Anyway, what do you guys have? Dont know if Ill buy a prefab or build. Just need some input and advice.
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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John my building is an old single story block building that lacks any ceiling height. But I've managed somehow over the years to work out of it. Any vehicle work has to be done outside which is one of the reason I quit lettering trucks.
Total square feet is around 3,200 plus I have a 12 x 60' trailer on the property for storage. We are getting pretty cramped and I hope in the future to have at least double that to handle our growth...Plan for the future and what you can afford.
-------------------- Bob Stephens Skywatch Signs Zephyrhills, FL
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I have abut 2200 square feet on the ground level that has the office and computer area than the rest is shop which has a 14' high door and about a 30' deep bay, the rest of the shop only has 8' ceiling.
Everywhere on the first floor that there is an 8' ceiling has an upstairs that we use for storage of all our material (we got a forklift to put it up there. It works out pretty good now but the mechanic in the next bay over is leaving in a couple months and I am going to take that space at that time (22'X35')
No matter what you do it won't be big enough.
-------------------- Jake Lyman Lyman Signs 45 State Road Phillipston, MA 01331 Posts: 635 | From: Phillipston, MA | Registered: Sep 2002
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We work out of a single story 2100 square foot area, with an extremly high traffic count.
That includes both buildings. We have updated the insulation, windows, and siding as well as gutting and drywalling the total interior. It was a big decision to do it, but, so far, so good. With your talents, you should have no problem covering the mortgage. Whatever you decide, I am sure it will be the right thing.
[ November 23, 2005, 07:22 PM: Message edited by: Rick Beisiegel ]
""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3489 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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you can only see about 1/3 of the building in that image, there is a bigger section of the building at 90 degrees to that part. also the windows you see at the bottom are high on the basement wall...so we've got 3 stories plus the full basement. a lot of the space is storage but we've got plenty of room to work on large projects...
the building itself is located close to a railroad, it used to be a seed company of some sort.
-------------------- Ryan Long Magic Light Neon Sign Co. Crawfordsville, IN Posts: 132 | From: Crawfordsville, IN | Registered: Jul 2005
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750 sq. ft. on the first floor of our commercial lease unit in a 24 ft' tall warehouse building. I have also built a second floor of about 700 sq. ft. (same as first minus the staircase) & a 3rd floor of about 650 (minus stairs & a space above a 2nd floor landing in front of roll door to forklift goods up to)
it's cramped, but it's working. Here's how it looks when you walk in now that I moved the production area out of sight to make room for the new inkjet equip.
Here is the production area right after construction, but before moving in the table, shelves & building an easel.
The material & substrate storage, panel saw & all the power tools are on the second floor. The paint & room to roll out panels is on the third floor.
[ November 23, 2005, 07:23 PM: Message edited by: Doug Allan ]
I do most everything I need to do with about 32 sq ft of floor space. If I gotta airbrush something I head out into the garage but even out there I only need about the same amount of room - about 8ft of wall space and a 4ft strip of clear floor so I don't trip over anything.
Ahhh... the beauty of shipping almost everyting! What doesn't get shipped, gets emailed for production.
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3489 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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SONGPAINTER Original Sign Music by Sign People NOW AVAILABLE on CD and the proceeds go to Letterville's favorite charity! Click Here for Sound Clips! Posts: 1974 | From: Orleans, MA, Cape Cod, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I hear ya Joe... but we wanted the best of both worlds when we built our shop. The fancyness of the building (and its cost) certainly effected the size of the building. But I think it was a good compromise.
Our studio/shop is 3200 square feet over all. The workshop area is 1550 with a 12 foot ceiling and a vaulted center section that goes up to 21 feet. It works well. We have a good amount of storage which measures out to be about 600 square feet. My studio is another 700 square feet... big but it holds a good size reference library and my various collections.
Overall the shop seems a little small at times. When it does, its time to clean up and get organized again.
While it could always be bigger when we are busy, I think our shop is the right size for our needs. I certainly wouldn't want to maintain, heat or make payments on anything larger. And I wouldn't want anything plainer than the outrageously decorated shop/studio we built.
I think we achieved the right balance for our needs. It makes me smile EVERY DAY when I walk out to the back 40 to go to work.
-grampa dan
[ November 24, 2005, 03:01 AM: Message edited by: Dan Sawatzky ]
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8739 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
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1400 sq ft, so a lot happens out in the open air! 10 ft ceiling height at the edges is too low for now. We're about to add a 800 sq ft carport to it & the same to the house, for shade. The office is in the house.
(& yes, nice bit of history Ryan!)
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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The rental unit that we have been in for the past 14 years is 1,600 square feet with a 10' overhead door in the rear. It is part of a four unit, tilt wall building of office and warehouse space. The office/showroom/design/vinyl cutting area is 40' x 40' and the only part of the building with heat and air. The production part is heated with kerosene (or propane) heaters in the winter and in the summer we just move the air around.
Fourteen years ago the rent was $300 a month and now it is $500.
Recently the landlord told the tenants that the building will be sold and the building cleared to construct a new office park, so like John, I will be moving soon.
It would be nice to have my own building, so I am as interested in the answers to this post as John.
On average, what is the per square foot construction cost of a commercial building in your neck of the woods? Not doctor and lawyer commercial building, but sign shop style?
I wish you the best John. Keep us informed on the progress.
-------------------- Chapman Sign Studio Temple, Texas chapmanstudio@sbcglobal.net Posts: 6306 | From: Temple, Texas, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I have a 24' sqaure garage that is mostly full of my adult son's CRAP, therefore about 10'x12' (or less) is useable. Whatever you build, make sure you have a big door for large trucks, and a man door. A bathroom is also nice. My office is 7'x10'. Just room enuff for a plotter and a cranky customer. Love.....Jill
Posts: 8834 | From: Butler, PA, USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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Okay I officially have too much junk....I have 7000 sq feet, about 1500 of which is just storage....how do you guys stow all your tools? Woodworking and whatnot? Dan HOW do you have room for all your big projects AND your MULTICAM?
[ November 25, 2005, 10:03 AM: Message edited by: Barry Branscum ]
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Barry, hang the tools on the walls! Anything handheld including powertools can hang by hooks from a steel grid or in a wooden cabinet just 12" deep.
That makes 'em real easy to find, no digging through cabinets, shelves or piles of junk trying to find what you need.
All the big stuff can be setup on wheels so you can tilt it back and roll around. When you set it down the legs take all the weight again making it stable.
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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In our shop. everything but the MutliCam is on wheels so our layout is somewhat flexible dependng on the size projects we have camping there.
It certainly gets tight at times, and often you have to weave to get from one side of the shop to the other. Even so I think I wouldn't want a bigger one. I would just collect more STUFF!
-grampa dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8739 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
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215 square feet in two different rooms (both are about 8 x 13). one is the "clean" area (paint and vinyl) and the other is the "dusty" area (sanding, cutting, routing).
Obviously, I don't do a lot of 4x8s. When I do more than one at a time, I do them outside. That's a benefit of a large yard and California weather.
Regardless of the square footage, having separate spaces is a BIG bonus.
-------------------- :: Scooter Marriner :: :: Coyote Signs :: :: Oakland, CA :: :: still a beginner :: :: Posts: 1356 | From: Oakland (and San Francisco) | Registered: Mar 2001
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I could talkj about my shop, but what you need is to define what you do to figure what yoiu need.
Do you need to spray paint indoors? Do you do woodwork and make dust that doesn't mix with painting? Do you need a bench for lettering or is it all vinyl that happens on tabletops? Do you need to drive trucks inside?
After determining what you do define an area for each and draw a plan with flow patterns showing where material gomes into the shop and how it flows till it's back out again. Do the flow pattern for a carved sign or a painted 4x8 or a truck. You need to draw in an area for paint mixing and screen storage and it doesn't need to be that big, but it needs to not having you stop production because one project is in the way of another.
I like the rolling tables, but still need to be able to have a place where I can cut boards while there is wet paint on panels and a truck prepped to letter.
Plan on where the phones will be and the wiring for computers and a sound system.
Design your lighting too.
-------------------- The SignShop Mendocino, California
Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6730 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Our vinyl, easel computer room is 20x12 with a 16' easel on one wall and a garage door. The showroom is also 20x12 with a 12' table for weeding and a vaulted ceiling. This building has central HVAC. I built the frame building myself but hired someone to do the steel one.
The cutting, sanding, fabrication shop is 50x30 with a 14' wall height, 12'x10' roll door, spray area with exhaust fan, at one end and a 16x4 work table at the other. The steel building has four skylights which, coupled with the white facing on the insulation, makes for adequate lighting during the day. I still don't have any lights installed. The ramp in front of the rolldor hasn't been poured yet so, all vehicles are done outside for now.
My 8x4 substrate storage is on wheels as are some of the stationary tools and it helps to be able to move stuff around. It's amazing how fast a place can fill up. We worked out of the small shop for 3 years before building the larger one. Now the large one is well stocked with junk. I think if our shop was twice as big, it would still be full.
The place is on a busy highway between two small towns (about 8 miles apart). The total shop area is 1980sqft.
The reason for no trusses on the front of the framed building is because the front half of the shop has a vaulted ceiling (rafters and a ridge beam).
[ November 26, 2005, 10:05 AM: Message edited by: Wayne Webb ]
-------------------- Wayne Webb Webb Signworks Chipley, FL 850.638.9329 wayne@webbsignworks.com Posts: 7404 | From: Chipley,Florida,United States | Registered: Oct 1999
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3,500 s/f in a multitenant building 16' door with room for a 48' trailer. Front showroom/vinyl room with office/digital room above. Seemed huge at first, now it's cramped at times.
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I believe anyone can make any space workable. I moved from a nice upstairs shop with a full double garage to my stuff in the above ground basement of this house and a single garage. Much tighter but workable and I don't have to heat a separate building this way.
One key ingredient above all; if you do large trucks, ensure the door height and garage area will allow for it if you like them to come to you. I simply don't understand how signshops in town make it without a bay for trucks or vehicles unless they are totally mobile, and therefore, are away from the storefront! Doesn't add up for me.
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I've got about a thousand square feet under roof. It's a garage with an attached carport which is also under roof, about 650 sq. ft., in case I want to work outside. I have two large plastic curtains on steel cables that I can slide in a couple different directions to divide off some space...so I can isolate the mess from sawing, sanding, grinding, welding, etc.
Low overhead, since it's next to my house. Worst part is 8 ft. ceilings. I'm always banging a board on a truss, or getting something hung up; but I'm making it work as best it can. Have a small office/vinyl area in one corner, but the computer and plotter are in the house. I'm getting ready to widen the front doors on the shop. They are only 8 ft. now, and difficult to get any vehicles in without messing with the mirrors.
But I'm happy with it. If I'd just get rid of some of my crap.....Yeah, I'm a packrat. But every now and then, that piece of 2" angle or that leftover 2 X 2 piece of 1/4" lexan comes in real handy for something. With the cost of all of our supplies going up everyday, I just hate to throw anything away.
Would like to have a big shop again, but staying small is somehow kinda peaceful. Don't have a boom anymore; no more 40 ft. ladders; no big portable generators; etc. Consequently, less headaches, and I really like it like that.
-------------------- Dale Feicke Grafix 714 East St. Mendenhall, MS 39114
"I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me." Posts: 2963 | From: Mendenhall, MS | Registered: Apr 1999
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"Clean" area is about 8'x10' for the computer stuff and cutter. Weeding and clean storage area is about 8'x25'.
The seperate "shop" is 25'x35' divided into two sections, the "diry" area with the saw and tools and stuff and the "clean" paint booth.
80% of my work involves trucks, trailers and sailboats. All of that work is done at the clients' locations.
The other 20% is handled very easily in my two workspaces.
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
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