posted
How come when I import a 480 KB jpg into Corel 12 it becomes a 5.43 MB file? Am I doing something wrong or is this normal?
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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posted
Okay - so this is normal.... Can anyone tell me where to change the import default values so I can resample before I import? I want to resize to a smaller size, but increase the default resolution from 72 dpi to 300 dpi. When I try to increase the resolution it won't take....and yes, my original is more than 300 dpi resolution.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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posted
As far as I know if you import a 50dpi jpeg into CorelDraw it is a 50 dpi jpeg and same goes if you import a higher resolution jpeg. After you import a jpeg right click it and choose properties you will find out what the dpi of the jpeg is that way. I am not sure what you need to do in the end so what is it that you really want to do?
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Sounds like somewhere along the way the file is resizing while maintaining resolution. That's about the only way a jpeg is gonna grow like that. I had the same thing happen with some files I sent from Signlab to AI 10.
posted
On the import pop up you have an option for full image, crop or resample...
-------------------- Mario G. Lafreniere (Fergie) J&N Signs Winter did show up! Posts: 1257 | From: Chapleau, Ontario | Registered: Jun 1999
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posted
Kelly..I got a reply to your questions soon after I posted them on the CorelDraw newsgroup.
The questions I asked are in the brackets the answers are from Foster Coburn, and he seems to be recognised as an expert on CorelDraw.
quote:<<When I import a bitmap that is, for example, 300 DPI Corel reduces it to 72 DPI. Can this default be changed?>>
Corel is a company, not a product. I assume you are talking about CorelDRAW. It absolutely, positively does NOT change the resolution of a bitmap just by importing it.
<<Also, the reason this question comes up is that when I import a 500K bitmap into Corel and then save the file as a CDR the CDR file will explode up to something like 5 meg. Why is this?>>
Most likely you are importing JPG files. They use lossy compression. CorelDRAW does compress CDR files but uses lossless compression so that your files don't get worse-looking with every save.
-- Foster D. Coburn III Unleashed Productions, Inc.
I did experiment with a few hi resolution digital photos and none would import above 72 DPI. However, when I scanned a regular 35mm photo at 300 DPI it imported at 300 DPI just like it should.
I am thinking that the problem lies in either digital pictures or JPG images or both.
Maybe someone else can shed more light on the topic?
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
posted
i'll be interested in the result of this, i dont know if you got my email Dave, but it took me ages to upload it (stuck on dial up for mo), once loaded it was 9mb !! for a 640x380 jpeg image that was originally less that 80kb, i know the stuff i'd overlayed was not worth 8.9mb !!!!
posted
Okay, so what I have found out is that although Corel Draw tells you it is importing the file at 72 dpi it really isn't, and that importing jpegs into illustrating programs like Corel Draw turns them into monster files.
And that Corel is a company...
Thanks so much for your time and help Dave and also to Mike for getting me going behind the scenes. This place rocks.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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posted
Hugh I do not know what you are doing, but I find it real hard to beleive that you made a cdr with a 80kb jpg then did a couple overlays and it is now 9mbs are you sure you did not also stretch out the jpeg to way larger than 640x380? Could you of also maybe performed a bitmap effect on the jpeg? Did you maybe change the mode of the jpg form rgb to cmyk? Let us know what you did and I am sure someone here can explain what happened to cause the increase in size. Like Dave and Foster said CorelDRAW does not change the jpeg it just stops using the compression so that is why the original file looks bigger. I imported a 123kb jpg and saved it the cdr turned out to be 526kb. Now if I would of exported the jpg back out of CorelDraw it would of used the compression again and made it small again.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
ah, you may have hit it on the head there Steve ! to scale the photo of the shop i'm doing i took just one vertical and one horizontal measurement and enlarged the pic to match the measurements, then drew over it and saved a a cdr, never thought about it growing in kb size !
posted
No Kelly still not right that is not what I said CorelDraw does not change the Jpg one bit on import period. Tell me what it is you are trying to do. Also what do you care how big your working file is in CorelDRAW in DRAW if you need to print the file at high resolution you want the biggest file you can get and if you are making something for the web well you will be exporting the graphic out as a rasterized picture so it will be only as large as you export it.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
I use photo paint and draw back to back. It may not be the recommended way though. I open the photo and resample to the size / resolution I want in Photo Paint. I then copy and paste into Draw. I do it many times a day. I then set the rest of the file in Draw, export as an .eps. Then RIP and print on the versacamm.
-------------------- Jerry VanHorn, Pres. Pure Sports Designs, LLC Pro Sign Design / United Wholesale Signs www.prosigndesign.comwww.unitedwholesalesigns.com West Liberty, OH 937-465-0595 866-942-3990 Since 1990 Posts: 925 | From: West :Liberty, OH | Registered: May 2004
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posted
I do not see any reason why you would be doing anything wrong working that way Jerry. i gets you the same results I am sure.
I normally import the photo into DRAW through the import function or by scanning in the photo, once in DRAW if I need to edit the photo I right click the photo and choose Edit. This then opens the photo into Photopaint, I then am working in Photopaint I make all the changes I need from cropping to masking to filter effects anything that Photopaint can do, once I am done I hit the save button and automatically the photo is updated in DRAW. I then close Photopaint and finish what I am doing in DRAW.
Jerry can you not print directly from CorelDRAW to the versacamm? Is there no windows driver for the versacamm?
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
I export the finished work as an .eps. I then open the file in Color Rip and rip/print from there.
-------------------- Jerry VanHorn, Pres. Pure Sports Designs, LLC Pro Sign Design / United Wholesale Signs www.prosigndesign.comwww.unitedwholesalesigns.com West Liberty, OH 937-465-0595 866-942-3990 Since 1990 Posts: 925 | From: West :Liberty, OH | Registered: May 2004
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posted
Ok but is a driver available? and have you tried it? If one was I think on easy jobs I would print direct or does this Color rip give you better control?
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Kelly, Jpg files are compressed , so what may be a 600kb file in .jpg format when opened in Corel and uncompressed turns it into a larger file. When saved in Corel it is saved in its un compressed form. That’s while the files are bigger. If you want to keep it the same size keep it saved as a jpg and not a Corel file. If you don’t need it that large resample to a smaller resolution that suits its use
Pictures are really comprised of a finite number of pixels that number never changes unless you resample. That is why DPI is a fairly confusing term because it depends at what size you are looking at it. It is a relative term depending on what size you are viewing it at.
Corel as a default puts the image at screen resolution 72dpi If your image is 2048 x 1536 (just happens what my camera is set at now) at 72 dot per inch the image is going to be 21.5" x 28.5" if you take the same image and resize it to 5.1" x 6.8" it will be roughly 300 dpi. If you take the picture once in Corel and scale the picture back in size you will notice the DPI going up the smaller it gets.
Depending on what you’re doing with it and what the finished size of the photo is going to be when produced should dictate how you resample it. The Best bet is to bring it into Corel and change the size to the finished size you would like and then look at DPI. 100 Dpi at full size will make very nice prints for General large format purposes (vehicle wraps etc)
You can always go down in resolution easily; going up is really just dividing what was there into smaller pieces. Instead of one black dot you have how ever many smaller ones it would take to make up the original. There are utilities that make enlarging bitmaps possible but they really are just adding pixels that blend color from the other nearby pixels.
I hope that made it a little clearer.
-------------------- Eric Roche Douglasville, GA
"Someday I'm gonna get a real job, HEE HEE" Posts: 97 | From: Douglasville, GA | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
In CorelDraw’s options, rulers, their is a place to change resolution, Eric yours must be set at 72 dpi mine was 300dpi I am not sure if I have changed that in the past so I am not sure if 72 is default. But what you are saying is correct.
Eric, one thing you say "is when opened in Corel" CorelDraw can not OPEN jpgs they must be IMPORTED or copy and pasted or draged and dropped into a page. I just do not want people to be confused I see allot of people try and open jpegs and then complain that their is, something wrong.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
After spending an afternoon playing around with all of this, I have a better understanding of why things happen the way they do regarding bitmaps and jpeg's in particular.
My work involves 98% vector work (vinyl cutting) and only 2% bitmap work, that being if I need an Edge print done for me. My only real interest in raster images in the past had been in taking pics of vehicles, boats, etc. and scaling them up to overlay vector graphics to get the sizing correct.
I've learned a lot today..just hope my brain retains the majority of it!!!
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
posted
Steve..What version of Draw are you using?? I went to "tools/options/document/rulers" and there is no reference to bitmap resolution there that I can see. But I do know that I read somewhere that the default CAN be changed.
[ June 21, 2005, 06:44 PM: Message edited by: Dave Grundy ]
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
What I have been trying to do was take some digital pictures and import them into Corel Draw 12. The problem was they were becoming such big files that I couldn't email them. I was not aware that jpgs were compressed, so I couldn't figure out why my file kept going from a relatively small file to this enormous one. If I am understanding you correctly it is because Corel Draw uncompresses the jpeg.
I imported the jpegs and then sized them down to the size I wanted which was about 10% of the original size. That left them at a resolution of 500+ dpi. I then resampled them to 300 dpi as that was what I had determined the optimum resolution for my purposes was. What I had was a 2"x3" image with a resolution of 300 dpi and some vector art on top of it. There were no gradient fills or anything fancy - the vector art added up to almost nothing but I was still facing files that were well over 5.5 MB.
I thought that I was doing something wrong. I called Dave and we tried importing the jpgs using the space bar (to import the file at its original size). We also tried to resample it while importing, but although I could change the size to 2" x 3", I could not change the resolution on the import box to 300 dpi, I could only reduce it. The maximum resolution it would allow me was 72 dpi and I know that the original file was a much higher resolution. So does that mean that the file was being imported at the 3" x 2" size and a resolution of 72 dpi? If so it should have been a considerably smaller file and it wasn't. The only way I could get the file down to a reasonable size to email was to reduce the resolution to 150 dpi and I didn't want to lose that quality.
I can't say I understand it all now, but I have a better sense of what is happening I think. If I had known I was working under the constraints of the way things are I wouldn't have been nearly as frusterated.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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posted
Hi Dave Duh! I had to set my rulers to pixels and then it shows up where it says edit scale.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Thanks Steve...Yep mine is set to 300 DPI too. As I said earlier, I can import scanned images at 300. I just still can't figure out why digital pics will only import at 72dpi max?
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
posted
Hi Kelley I think you are making this harder than it needs to be HAHAHA Something still is not right as far as I can see. Ok my question is how are you reducing the resolution to 150dpi to get the file size down? Also could you send me the file so I can figure out what it is you are doing that might be causing the problem. For me I have a 2'x3' bitmap at 150 dpi and it is 144kb and if I have the bitmap at 300dpi my cdr file size is 496kb. So your file sizes should be around the same.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Glad I made a little sense anyway. To the best of my knowledge,Yes Corel is uncompressing the file and hence the larger file size.
Are you tryng to e-mail customers proofs with the signage superimposed or something similar? for on screen viewing 72 dpi will do just fine in most cases
If the files are still turning out to large you can always export as a .jpg and send it in the compressed format.
What is the end use of the image you trying to create, very often I found myself using much more resolution than I needed. I have cut way back on resolution in a lot of cases.
In other cases where the resolution was needed rather than e-mail I would have to mail a cd or use an FTP site to upload to.
Something seems a little strange, I imported a jpg and sized to 3" x 2" at 300 dpi and I have a 1.8 meg corel file size.
When you import the file into corel with out resizing what size does it measure and what is its resolution?
There are settings or options somewhere giving you this grief.
-------------------- Eric Roche Douglasville, GA
"Someday I'm gonna get a real job, HEE HEE" Posts: 97 | From: Douglasville, GA | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
Is that the problem Kelly is bringing in jpgs from her digital camera? That is an issue I am not sure why it does it either. I try never to use my digital cameras jpg compression I take my photos in raw and convert to tif and import the tif file. Now I have a nice 6 mega pixel camera that interpolates to 12 mega pixel and when I bring in a highest resolution photo you are right it comes in very large in size but at 72dpi. But if I bring in the converted raw tif file it is sized properly at 300dpi. Now I use a Fuji S7000 but at work the photo person uses a real high end Nikon and her jpeg photos come in CorelDraw at 300 dpi. I think this is a camera compression issue and not a CorelDraw issue.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Kelly why are you sending out your working CorelDRAW file? I try to only send out a pdf file of my finished graphic that way I know that my files integrity stays the same
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
I hope Kelly doesn't mind me replying. Steve, as to why Kelly was wanting to send a working file, it was to send it to another signmaker/friend to get some digital print work done.
[ June 21, 2005, 09:42 PM: Message edited by: Dave Grundy ]
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
posted
Well thats ok, I do have to travel with my cdr files every once and a while and yes sometimes they can get large. That's why cdrom burners and flash drives come in handy. Another option for Kelly is she does all the work in CorelDraw then she strips out the jpg and sends it seperately, and they put it back together on the other PC.
Dave I find it quite fun to see how other people work in CorelDraw since I am self taught so figuring how other people do things every once in a while I learn another trick or two.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
A JPEG file is like a suitcase. It's only small until you need to look at what's inside. This is common in Photoshop as well; when the file is opened, it's much larger than when it's closed.
If the JPEG is brought into CorelDRAW, and then saved in combination with vector art, it's probably not going to compress the JPEG anymore when it saves. I wouldn't expect it to have optimal compression at that point.
My mind wanders. And that's not a good thing, 'cause it's too small to be out there alone. Posts: 3129 | From: Tooele, UT | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
Steve you were asking about printing directly From coreldraw to the versacamm... works fine and it is a postscript driver. That's the way I've always printed using versaworks and versacamm. It's way quicker than exporting as .eps then opening with the rip.
Still have full control over the output with the rip software.
[ June 21, 2005, 10:43 PM: Message edited by: Mike O'Neill ]
-------------------- Mike O'Neill
It has yet to be proven that intelligence has any survival value. - Arthur C. Clarke
posted
I think for all intensive purposes the jpeg stops being a jpeg and starts being just a raster image once in CorelDRAW.
CorelDraw only makes it a jpeg again if you export the graphic again.
I do not think a jpeg is like a suitcase unless your suitcase throws away your clothes everytime you close the lid. HAHAHA
If you ever try zipping a group of jpgs they barely compress at all because they are all ready compressed.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Hi Mike I figured the export as eps might of been extra work. I wonder if their is a chance that some effects can be lost in the eps file conversion.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
I think the issue was more likely to do with corel's color management. The correct answer is to turn it off and let the rip handle color profiles.
-------------------- Mike O'Neill
It has yet to be proven that intelligence has any survival value. - Arthur C. Clarke
posted
Thanks for your help as well Steve, I emailed a file to you - I did manage to get them down to just over 3 MG by resizing them in an entirely different program. I'm thinking maybe there is some conflict between my digital camera program and Corel Draw, because I can filter them through my old digital camera program and get them to import at a smaller size, albeit still larger than I see reason for.
Right now I am just plain swamped and what should have been a fifteen min process turned into the better part of a day. I was trying to get some time sensitive files sent to Suelynn for printing.
Mike set me up with a ftp server and things are handled for this go round.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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posted
Well, my simple suitcase analogy was intended to explain how a file can be large and small at the same time, not the clothes-losing dynamics of lossy compression. Lossy compression is like a dryer, where everytime you do a load of laundry you lose a sock.
My mind wanders. And that's not a good thing, 'cause it's too small to be out there alone. Posts: 3129 | From: Tooele, UT | Registered: Mar 2005
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Corel now has a RAW utility to process your digital pics in the RAW format. Its free for you to download from corel.com
-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5274 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
Hi Russ how do you know what happens with a dryer? HAHAHA
Thanks Curtis I am going to go check it out.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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