Hey all. Received a call from Sandy Baird (thanks Sandy) this morning regarding some of my sign images being used on a sign franchise website passing the work off as their own. Even so far as to post ca copyright notice. ...takes all kinds. Aside from copyright infringement, it's just wrong. I've been in touch...
Point is, I've noticed some fellow crafters signs on there as well, including Dan Sawatzky and Rene Giroux.
Looks like they have scanned a few trade magazines. They even have other shops ads. Tacky, tacky, tacky!
Posted by Craig Sjoquist (Member # 4684) on :
WOW how rude can ya get, excuse maybe just because it is seen online, they think it can be used MAYBE
That very is rude.
Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :
Idiocy on parade.
Posted by Neil D. Butler (Member # 661) on :
How Nice!!! Hate to say it, I know I'm going to sound Racist... Nope Not going to say it...lol
Posted by Michael Clanton (Member # 2419) on :
at least they have good taste- I didn't see one "peeing Calvin" or Brush Script CAPS on a curve...
A similar thing happened in the photography world- a friend of mine is a pro, and he hired a girl to be a 2nd shooter at a wedding- she did fine, but a few months later it was discovered that she had used another photogs work on her website (implying that it was her own work). She apologized publicly, took them down and replaced with her own work, but it was too late the damage had been done- the pro photog world beat her down so bad that she had to quit the profession. It was very ugly, and even though she did good work, nobody would hire her.
Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :
I noticed another long-time Letterhead's work also posted on that site. I called Dave Beatty to give him a heads up as well. Ironically, they not only posted his work...but also a picture of him holding up a finished piece. Nervy to say the least. They also proudly display the Better Business Bureau logo, implying membership...but I have to wonder if they're even members in good standing.
Posted by Billie DeBekker (Member # 3848) on :
Every photo on that website is a Sign I have seen someplace else.. I don't think they have a Sign of their own on that thing.. I would be contacting their ISP and file a copy write complaint.
Posted by Alicia B. Jennings (Member # 1272) on :
Well, we can all keep them very busy by asking for "Free" sign quotes. "Ah, how much is a sign like the one in picture five, but I will be using my own design, one that I designed myself, I want more color than the,,,,,, Drive em nuts.
Posted by Ricardo Davila (Member # 3854) on :
On looking at these websites I, also, noticed how they go about the wording around the images.......They never claim to have created, manufactured or installed any of the signs shown in that website......They are just showing the viewer the images of the different kinds of signs that they are selling.......This is as far as I go on that topic......I have no idea if this is legal or is an infringement of copyright.....It may be...But it looks, more, like a misleading act of lack of integrity.
However, this reminds me, that during the days of "no computer", back in 1977, while living in Florida, I was doing a lot of sign work for this new sign shop, in Coral Springs, Fla.........Lettering signs,billboards,vehicles, walls,windows, etc. and, also, making sign patterns for neon tubing on storefront windows, channel letters installations ( on walls ), etc.
I was not an employee of this sign shop, I was just a contractor ( freelancer ), working for a percentage of the selling price of every project.
The owner of the sign shop had three salesmen, working on commission, who always wore nice suits, ties, carried expensive briefcases and drove nice cars.
They usually left the shop every Monday morning,around 10am, right after they had finished planning their sales for the week, during their usual sales meeting, and returned back to the shop the next Friday, to turn in all the job orders they had closed throughout the week.
These salesmen covered the whole State of Florida, from Key West to the Panhandle, selling all kinds of signs.....mostly electrical signs for shopping malls, apartment complexes, golf courses, storefronts, vehicle fleets, etc.
Other than their selling skills, the only sales tool that each salesman carried was a portfolio full of skillfully cut ( by the sign shop owner's wife ), colored, photographs of signs made by other sign craftsmen, at other shops, all over the country....which had been carefully extracted from the Signs of the Times magazine.....and nothing else.
Incidentally, the shop owner, had, previously, been a plumber, for many years ( in California ), before coming to live in Florida. He never could make a sign, by himself, if his life depended on it.
We all made a lot of money, in those days, because of this man without integrity.....He died of old age and a very rich man, while retired in Bonita Beach, Fla.
Thought I would share this little story with you guys......Somewhere in there, there is a lack of integrity lesson to be learned.....if you choose to do so.
[ April 01, 2013, 06:49 PM: Message edited by: Ricardo Davila ]
Posted by Sandy Baird (Member # 4773) on :
Hi, I happened on the whole thing by checking out Pinterest and saw Shane's sign that took me to Flikr and then on to 1stopvisual.com I got a hold of Shane and we chatted about the whole thing. I mentioned that I had posted some of my signs on pinterest and then pulled them all off and added my website in the corner of the picture and re-posted. I think this is something we should all make a habit of even when posting a picture here. It is so easy to lift a image off the web. I know with a little photoshop or a careful crop they can remove the watermark, but based on what I have seen, laziness seems to go along with swiping images. Just a thought. We all have to look out for each other.
[ April 01, 2013, 08:14 PM: Message edited by: Sandy Baird ]
Posted by David Harding (Member # 108) on :
I'm so insulted. So far, I haven't found any of my work there. He could at least have posted some of my stellar examples of hand lettering... oh wait! Those sure wouldn't have sold anything.
Posted by Sandy Baird (Member # 4773) on :
Just an update on this company. I looked at their webpage and noticed the BBB logo, the SAC-ACE and other logos they say they are a member of. I check with the Ontario Better Business Bureau and they are not a member. I checked with the Sign Association of Canada of Canada and they are not a member, and the woman I spoke with said they have been in touch with the company to have them remove their logo from the page, after recieving an email from Steve Greer. Please take a look on their website and see if any of your work is there. If so, contact them. If you see work of other sign artists you know, contact them and let them know. I have contacted the company myself and told them that they must correct the page immediately and made sure they understood how wrong they are. I also told them that the Flickr page was worse, as they put their copyright tag under work they had taken and portrayed as their own. I have even seen a sign by Periandros Damoulis in Greece on the site. I am hoping that with enough pressure the two sites will be fixed very soon.
Posted by Shirley Carron (Member # 2446) on :
I requested quotes for signs done by Shane, Dan and Rene but they haven't responded. I came across this happening a few years ago with a company here in Ottawa. The owner had bought into a sign franchise and put up a web site showing other signmakers work; I suggested he replace the photos with project of his own. I've also had an ex employee take credit for signs they did not do, but had been done in my shop while they were employed. One such employee later tried to pawn my work off as his own to get a job working with Shane and I believe he worked with Dave Beatty for a short time...the nerve!!! He has since moved back into the Ottawa area and is still going about saying he did this or that sign (my signs)and trying to get work that way. I suppose it makes for a good idea to put some kind of company tag on the projects, or decal or something that works like a signature. Do most of you practice this?
Posted by Rusty Bradley (Member # 6938) on :
Nice one David.
Posted by Brent Logan (Member # 6587) on :
I've worked with a handful of outstanding, dedicated and honest sign salesmen over the years but unfortunately many are pretty low on the food chain. A lot of these people are nothing but "widget" salesmen who bounce around from one industry to another and are only concerned with commissions.
[ April 02, 2013, 04:37 PM: Message edited by: Brent Logan ]
Posted by Dan Sawatzky (Member # 88) on :
They must have got tired of nasty emails and calls (mine included) for the website is now down for maintenance.
Thanks to those watching out for us and for the time to let those involved know.
-grampa dan
Posted by Sandy Baird (Member # 4773) on :
There is a lot more work for this company to do before they erase their mistakes.
I went back to Pinterest and they still have images of others work with their tagline.
Then, just this morning I followed a like to a number of Youtube videos that contain others work. Shane, your gallery sign is on this youtube video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ualt9mNA4Mg
I will drop them a call tomorrow if these other sites aren't cleaned up.
Posted by David Harding (Member # 108) on :
If you look at their storefront photos, doesn't it seem incongruous that a shop that uses such tacky layouts on their building along with Brush Script on their flyer could come up with all the beautiful, well thought out work they claim to have done?
I've seen some brazen claims in my time but this one takes the cake. Thanks to Sandy and Shane for bringing it to our attention.
Posted by Rusty Bradley (Member # 6938) on :
Truely a talented group of artist...con artist that is.
Posted by Dave Grundy (Member # 103) on :
I had to laugh....Like many, I sent an e-mail to this company expressing my thoughts about their dubious advertising.
Their response to my comment was to "block" my Mexican ISP!!!!
No big deal, I doubt that anyone from this area is going to order a sign from them anyway. There are plenty of much more talented sign painters and graphic designers, than they are, here!!! Posted by Ian Stewart-Koster (Member # 3500) on :
Yes, their site is down, and the original links Shane put up are defunct...
Well done for noticing it, Sandy!
Posted by Sandy Baird (Member # 4773) on :
I have gone about as far as I can go. I tried to have all of the images that belong to sign artists here and abroad removed, but because I wasn't the one who had my pictures used, I am unable to get the images off flickr and youtube. All of the pictures that where on the website are also on those two sites. here is the message from flickr:
Hello,
Thank you for contacting Flickr Member Support.
The Flickr team greatly respects the intellectual property of creators. Issues of infringement are handled for us by the specialists within the Yahoo! Copyright Team. Please click the "Copyright/IP Policy" link that's available in the footer of every page to reach your Yahoo! Copyright Team, where you will be able to file a Notice of Infringement.
(Only the copyright holder can file a Notice of Infringement.) Thank you again for contacting us. If you have any other questions, please feel free to reply to this email.
Regards, Flickr staff
The youtube site has the same complaint system, so if your images are on the sites, you will have to make the complaint yourself. 1stop signs, feels they have done enough and are unwilling to do anything to flickr and youtube.
I'm done. It up to you if you want to pursue it.
Sandy
Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :
The site is back up. Dan's sign is still up under "corporate".
Posted by Ian Stewart-Koster (Member # 3500) on :
Wow, that is cheeky, as well as an honour, and disgusting & dishonest at the same time...
Posted by Bill Davidson (Member # 531) on :
flicker is down, youtube is still up.
Posted by Guy H. J. Hilliard (Member # 2529) on :
I had a similar issue with a company that had used some of my images (laser engraved business cards). I found the ISPs that were hosting their site and sent them a "Notice of Copyright Violation" (a copy can be found at Godaddy.com) along with a description of the images that belonged to me (URL addresses of the images) it took a week but the images were taken off their site (and replaced with other images from the web).
The excuse that the web site owner gave me was that they had a company in India develop their website and they had the right to use any image on the web as it was in public domain.
Posted by David Harding (Member # 108) on :
They've staked claims on pictures pulled from just about every trade journal article, supplier catalog and ad for the sign industry. That's some real chutzpah.
Posted by Sandy Baird (Member # 4773) on :
The last time I contacted them to compain, I told them, that, they have 3 location. You must have created enough signs of your own to fill your website. Use images of your own work and avoid this hastle.
She the asked If it would be OK for them to farm any 3d work out to me. I couldn't help laughing out loud, but explained I didn't think that was a good idea, for me, and I passed.
I guess they felt I had been a pain in their ass,long enough, and this might get me to back off. I would have been more impressed by the offer had they used any of my images on their site, and had an idea of the work I do.
![[Rolling On The Floor]](graemlins/rolf.gif)