posted
This may get long, so please bear with me. I have what used to be a good customer. I have done signs, trucks, job trailers, and window lettering for them. Last winter they call and want a price on an illuminated sign to go on their building. I promptly got them a price and was told they would do something in the spring, no problem. Well one spring day I see a nice new sign on the building. I wouldn't feel so bad, but the sign company didn't even do the logo right. My wife even noticed that from about 75 yards away and mentioned it before I could. I also do work for one of partners brothers, and while doing some work for him shortly after that he told me he thought they got a pretty good deal on the sign, not knowing I even quoted it. That was fine until he told me what they paid, it actually ended up being $800 more than what I quoted them. Now, I get a phone call yesterday that they need a copy of their logo for some print advertising. It's not a logo that I created, but I did spend a few hours re-creating it (which I didn't charge for) for the work I had done for them. Do I give it to them or not? My feeling right now is, no. Opinions?
-------------------- Mike Murray Murray Signs Freeport IL Posts: 192 | From: Freeport IL USA | Registered: May 1999
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Hiya Mike, The easiest way to handle the situation is to charge the client an archive fee for his artwork. We ususally charge $25-50 per disk to burn the information to a cd rom. It normally includes a few different file types that the client can use. This assumes that the client already paid for your time to create the art to begin with. Another brainstorm that just hit me - if there's space available on the disk, include your company information on the disk too. It could be a simple web page or a pdf document that has a few samples of your work and a way to contact you.
Havin' fun,
Checkers
-------------------- a.k.a. Brian Born www.CheckersCustom.com Harrisburg, Pa Work Smart, Play Hard Posts: 3775 | From: Harrisburg, Pa. U.S.A. | Registered: Nov 1998
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i would say...in order for me to get you a certain type of file it's going to take some time..because i work in a sign program...if you would like i will provide you with a cd with various file formats (ai, eps, bmp, jpg, pdf, gif)for a fee of $$(you fill in)
i am going thru something similar right with a new customer...he designed this logo in some hokey program that can't export anything vector...so i have spent over 2 hours recreating it. i'm making 3-4 signs for them....however if they ask me to provide them with artwork that is vectorized i will say that i will provide them with a cd with every file format i can think of for $150.00...or the next guy can fart around with it and they take the chance of someone else not making it exact...i was hired to make signs, if they want artwork that's going to make their life easier they must pay!....or get real program.
-------------------- Karyn Bush Simply Not Ordinary, LLC Bartlett, NH 603-383-9955 www.snosigns.com info@snosigns.com Posts: 3516 | From: Bartlett, NH USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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I really dislike it when a customer has so little loyalty.
One option of course is to let them have the logo along with a bill for the corrections and adaptations, saying you would not have charged for them if you had remained their sign supplier.
The second is to tell them about the unbilled corrections and let them have the logo along with expressing the hope that they remember the good service you have given them in the past, and that you remain available to do their work in the future. I would it in some sort of form of writing, could be a regular bill stating the value and a No Charge notation.
Some things are just a Bummer, and that is all I see that you could reasonably do and get your point across.
-------------------- Myra A. Grozinger Signs Limited Winston-Salem, NC
signslimited@triad.rr.com Posts: 1244 | From: Winston-Salem, NC USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Man, that WAS kind'a weird that such a reg. customer would dog-you-out like that an' kick theirself in the butt at the same time!!
I betch'a there was some kind'a "backed into a corner" thing goin' on by a couzin or somethin',lol. Mabey the sales person was extremely georgeous and an' affair ensued, lol, or mabey a black-mail situation is involved here. Mabey the person tol' you a lie about the real cost of the sign . . . .GASP!!! Be objective man, these things happen, lol
In all actuality, if they are as good of a customer as you say, you should be able to communicate openly. Of course, they've shown that they will disregard that act, but that does'nt mean you have to. I'd go to them and say look this is the original logo that we've been using and I will now have a charge for the change. Also, I'd mention the electric sign and ask things like how do you like your new sign, are you satisfied with that purchase, That you noticed the logo change and was that at their direction or a mistake, etc., to generate openness on yer part and re-establish a better communication so something like this would'nt happen again.
HEY! I'm slap full of advice & opinions, huh!! That'll teach ya to title a post that way!!
-------------------- Signs Sweet Home Alabama
oneshot on chat
"Look like a girl, act like a lady, think like a man, work like a dog" Posts: 5758 | From: "Sweet Home" Alabama | Registered: Mar 2003
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Try to take the emotion away from this transaction and how would handle this to another good customer?
Take that decision and add to it the intention of confronting the customer as to why you did not get that last job. If you have the following you detail here then it is right in my opinion to ask.
You either have to resolve this in your mind or write them off as a good customer.
Personally I would tell them to get it from the other sign maker seeign as he did such a sucky job to begin with.
-------------------- Bob Rochon Creative Signworks Millbury, MA 508-865-7330
"Life is Like an Echo, what you put out, comes back to you." Posts: 5149 | From: Millbury, Mass. U.S. | Registered: Nov 1998
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I think the real key here is how to handle the immediate request by the customer.
Regardless of how you may feel personally, or what kind of history you have with them, the company who made the illuminated sign may have limitations in their production capabilities that kept the design from being accurately reproduced on the sign. I'll take a wild stab in the dark, but that's probably why they have called you back in to do the print artwork...for the accuracy and consistancy of the image they want to convey.
Should that be the case, bill them accordingly for your time.
Then again, whadda I know? Rapid
[ December 16, 2003, 01:56 PM: Message edited by: Ray Rheaume ]
-------------------- Ray Rheaume Rapidfire Design 543 Brushwood Road North Haverhill, NH 03774 rapidfiredesign@hotmail.com 603-787-6803
I like my paint shaken, not stirred. Posts: 5648 | From: North Haverhill, New Hampshire | Registered: Apr 2003
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did you tell them that you woulda done the lighted sign for less money and how the got taken? that would 1st thing i did as i give them them ther logo in a jpg at 72 dpi.
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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You still have a good client. Try to move past your natural feeling of being shanked.
To deal with the immediate request - why not give them the 300 dpi jpg that they need for printing. That'll satisfy their request. Snicker up your sleeve as you're handing it to them if you like, knowing it won't help your competition at all.
As for losing the electric sign job - you got out-sold. Somebody who does inferior work at a higher price gave a better sales pitch. When your client asked you for a "price quote", you gave them exactly what they asked for. However, when they asked an electric sign sales person for a "price quote", they got a full blown sales presentation. And probably with a different group of people in your client's organization than you normally deal with.
Before being too harsh (and resentful) on your client, remember that alot of business people consider electric signage - with all the permits, licenses, UL listings, cranes, etc. - to be an area where most of us "sign shops" aren't qualified; where we don't want to and aren't able to compete.
Otherwise, good clients are hard to come by and need regular servicing. Hope you're able to maintain your good relationship with this one.
Good Luck!
-------------------- Jack Leyden Jack's Signage 1330 "H" East St. Andrew Place Santa Ana,CA 92705 Posts: 22 | From: Santa Ana,CA | Registered: Nov 2001
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Good point about the nature of the electric sign biz. I tend seldom to get involved with electrical signage for many of the same reasons you listed and, as a result, it's very infrequent that someone inquires about them.
Great first post and welcome to Letterville. Rapid
-------------------- Ray Rheaume Rapidfire Design 543 Brushwood Road North Haverhill, NH 03774 rapidfiredesign@hotmail.com 603-787-6803
I like my paint shaken, not stirred. Posts: 5648 | From: North Haverhill, New Hampshire | Registered: Apr 2003
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posted
Over the years I have had customers"migrate" to another shop! The PITA ones don't usually come back, and it doesn't bother me!
The good customers come back, because they see that a lower price is not better, and a "low ball" quote always cost them more in the end. They wind up as very loyal customers. I have customers that have been calling me for 34 years (their sons, cause Dad has retired).
Get over the hurt feelings, it's only business, and not personal!
Just my humble opinion!
-------------------- Si Allen #562 La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
si.allen on Skype
siallen@dslextreme.com
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"
Never mess with your profile while in a drunken stupor!!!
Brushasaurus on Chat Posts: 8827 | From: La Mirada, CA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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No matter how else you handle it, DO NOT GIVE IT TO THEM. The quickest way to loose a customer is to give him your work. They will feel that if they come again that you are going to make up for the freeby by charging extra on any subsequent work. "Been there, done that"
-------------------- Frisby Signs, Inc. El Dorado, Arkansas Posts: 902 | From: El Dorado, Arkansas, USA | Registered: Apr 1999
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I found out from them that the company that did the electric sign quoted one price but had all these "extras" on the bill after it was installed. They were not happy to say the least. Guess I got out sold, but that's not how I like to sell my signs. So, I got a good laugh out of that and ended up sending the file to them, along with a bill for my time to do it. No questions, no complaints from their end. All is well.......for now. Thanks to everyone for your input.
-------------------- Mike Murray Murray Signs Freeport IL Posts: 192 | From: Freeport IL USA | Registered: May 1999
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There are a lot of shops that tack on add services as part of the way they do business, when a bid goes out, it's always best to incluude specs and a very good drawing showing detail, that way they have to bid it as drawn and be closer to what everyone else might bid.
-------------------- Rick Chavez Hemet, CA Posts: 1538 | From: Hemet,CA U.S.A. | Registered: Jun 2001
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