posted
The other day I posted regarding a reader's choice Signs of the Times contest. The final round of the contest featured six signs. Three were dimensional. Three were lit flat signs with layers. All of the designs, in my opinion were outstanding and deserved to be there. (since one was ours I may be a little biased)
Many thousands of votes later it is interesting to see the results. The three dimensional signs have garnered 94.4% of the popular vote, leaving only 5.6% of the vote going to the flatter signs.
While these results are not scientific they do a show an interesting trend. People seem to favor dimension, texture and old fashioned craftsmanship. I take this to mean we have a wonderful opportunity.
I know from experience there is a big demand for this kind of work. I also know there are not a whole lot of people doing it meaning there isn't a whole lot of competition. I also know that if I can sell this kind of work right here in little old Yarrow and the outlying areas that it can be sold elsewhere too. If fact we are increasingly selling and shipping our work far afield. If I can sell it there it is my bet that the locals could too if they were to offer it.
Opportunity knocks. Everywhere.
-grampa dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8738 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
This is good news for many, one problem, there would be trouble trying to compete with the shop that has the latest equipment. Dimensional signs are the best and will always attract the most attention. Flat signs with a picture are the next best thing. This is just the opinion of an old sign painter.
-------------------- Bill Riedel Riedel Sign Co., Inc. 15 Warren Street Little Ferry, N.J. 07643 billsr@riedelsignco.com Posts: 2953 | From: Little Ferry, New Jersey, USA | Registered: Feb 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
I have always liked demensioal signs. Not just the all out 3D, but sandblasted, layered substrates, relief carved. They all just pop! Even signs that are hung by interesting sign hanging systems, such as a decorative iron bracket with swirlly things. Not to mentioned the correct lighting. A flat painted/printed sign that reads "Hamburgers" can be nice, but you add a relief carving of a burger, it's poping. I used to like the old tire displays that had the top tire spinning, that was a 3D with movement.
-------------------- Signs by Alicia Jennings (Mudflap Girl) Tacoma, WA Since 1987 Have Lipstick, will travel. Posts: 3812 | From: Tacoma, WA. U.S.A. | Registered: Dec 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
Can anyone describe why or what it is about dimensional signs that really set them apart in the real world???? I have my own theory......what's yours?
Joe,
Makin Chip$ and Havin Fun!
-------------------- Joe Cieslowski Connecticut Woodcarvers Gallery P.O.Box 368 East Canaan CT 06024 jcieslowski@snet.net 860-824-0883 Posts: 2345 | From: East Canaan CT 06024 | Registered: Nov 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Dimensional signs are all about texture, the interplay of light and shadow. In a world of computer generated sameness they stand out from the crowd in an instant.
Dimensional signs appeal in so many ways - they are tactile - even visually. In the real world there aren't many things at are flat. We are used to seeing texture and form.
-grampa dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8738 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
Our clientel wants it to look real...(message clear) As Dan mentioned above the digital world has become mundane and in an attempt to make the work stand out more detail(photographs etc) are being added only to add to the confussion (to much detail & to many colours) so that the meassage is lost in it all (now let me say there are some acceptions) but I fine the majority to be this way and I'm sure we can list many reasons why...But whether its Dan's sculptured Train or Joes carved hawk, the messages are clean and uncluttered, drawing you in...Of course layout has also a lot to do with it...With dimension you can build character, a feeling which appeals to people, for example " hey look at that cool sign, let check it out"...Dimensional signs speaks to people subliminally saying, this is a professional business whose here for the long haul and with that much care put into thier sign are also going to look after me as a customer...Anyway could go on but hopefully this gives the gist to what we feel here...
-------------------- Pat Welter Masterhand Signs and Designs Unity, Saskatchewan.Canada Posts: 1304 | From: Unity, Saskatchewan.Canada | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
Joe's work is a wonderful example of good dimensional work. I'll bet if he had one of his beautifully carved signs next to a flat version people would instantly gravitate towards the carved one. I'll even bet that if both were at ground level most people couldn't resist touching his work... and in the process would ALWAYS remember the sign and Joe's work. The flat version - instantly forgettable.
As Pat says above - people want REAL in this plastic world.
-grampa dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8738 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
Joe, I would say it is the difference between getting a picture of a thing and getting a thing. It is all about the realness of an object in a spacial sense. It also apeals to another of our senses. While they my not be allowed to actually hold it certainly would be possible.
-------------------- Bob Sauls Sauls Signs & Designs Tallahassee, Fl
"Today I'll meet nice people and draw for them!" Posts: 765 | From: Tallahassee, Fl | Registered: Jun 2009
| IP: Logged |
posted
Also "Prestige" like a Rolls Royce... Some of it is about image and perception of professionalism & longevity.
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
First, let me say thank you for the compliments and.......back at you! There are many here who make fine dimensional signs and I'm honored to be among you.
Certainly everyone's responses are correct. What I was looking for was what Dan said in his second post..."the interplay of light and shadow".
That is the key. Flat signs can create the illusion of dimension by using highlights and shadows but it is just an illusion. As you move around it or as the time of day changes, the illusion stays the same and in our minds, it is dismissed (usually without any thought).
Dimensional signage on the other hand is constantly changing with the viewing perspective as well as the light of day. It draws your attention because it is "real" (as Bob said). You could almost say it is alive.....sorta.
Dans full 3D creations are the best you can get.....even when you are behind the moose, you know what it is.
I good relief carving is a good read for about 160 degrees on each side. As you move across it, the perspective of the image changes.......similar to Dans, just not for 365.
If I get a chance I'll see if I can get some pictures of one of my reliefs to illustrate this.
Thanks for the input......I always liked to ask "why"......I guess I have been asking since I was 3.
Joe,
Makin Chip$ and Havin Fun!
-------------------- Joe Cieslowski Connecticut Woodcarvers Gallery P.O.Box 368 East Canaan CT 06024 jcieslowski@snet.net 860-824-0883 Posts: 2345 | From: East Canaan CT 06024 | Registered: Nov 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
And another perspective. Those of us who don't have a CNC router...what are the possibilities? I believe it was at one of Mike Meyers meets that Pat Welter showed off his CNC router, chisel in hand, and demoed it. And Pat, haven't seen you since then. You and another gentlemen, darn I'm terrible at names - were so helpful to me in jumping into glass gilding/ gold leaf. That guy passed a few weeks after he had gold leafed the fire truck at that meet in Please type back here with his name as I know many knew and appreciated him and his talent. So, any thoughts from those doing dimensional work sans router. Some tips, ideas or pics as inspiration?
Mick Samsel
-------------------- Mick Samsel Creative Services Cherokee, IA Posts: 498 | From: Cherokee, Ia USA | Registered: Jan 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
And another perspective. Those of us who don't have a CNC router...what are the possibilities? I believe it was at one of Mike Meyers meets that Pat Welter showed off his CNC router, chisel in hand, and demoed it. And Pat, haven't seen you since then. You and another gentlemen, darn I'm terrible at names - were so helpful to me in jumping into glass gilding/ gold leaf. That guy passed a few weeks after he had gold leafed the fire truck at that meet in Please type back here with his name as I know many knew and appreciated him and his talent. So, any thoughts from those doing dimensional work sans router. Some tips, ideas or pics as inspiration?
Mick Samsel
-------------------- Mick Samsel Creative Services Cherokee, IA Posts: 498 | From: Cherokee, Ia USA | Registered: Jan 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
A CNC router is just a tool. I've been doing dimensional signs for almost 40 years but only had a router for the last seven or so.
Dimensional signs can be made so many ways. Cutouts and layers are one way. Carving or sculpting is another. A CNC router only automates part of the process. Even with a CNC router we are doing half or more of every project by hand.
Gary Anderson one of the notable dimensional sign makers doesn't own a CNC machine. He cuts things by hand, often uses layers and farms out the occasional piece as well.
The key as always is design. Then you just have to figure out a way to do it with the means at your disposal.
Most important fed your passion and have fun!
-grampa dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8738 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
Dan is right. A CNC router is just a tool to help you with the production of the parts you plan to use in your design. It does a lot of the work for you while you do other things with the project like assembling or painting. I just sold a Sports Complex sign today that I designed to be 3 dimensional. It will be a challenge and push me to try new techniques which I was reluctant to do a few short years ago.
I guess a big thank you is in order to Dan for proving it doesn't matter where you are located if you want to make 3 dimensional signs. I have a couple more proposals submitted for more 3D work and I'm 99% sure I will get them.
Thanks Dan (officially!) for blazing the trail into the creative 3 dimensional jungle! It looks like it's going to be a really fun year after all.
Sign-cerely, Steve
-------------------- Steve Luck Sign Magic Inc. 2718-b Grovelin Godfrey, Illinois 62035 (618)466-9120 signmagic@sbcglobal.net Posts: 870 | From: 2718-b Grovelin Godfrey, Illinois 62035 | Registered: Dec 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yes, these are just tools, in one mans hands the carving chisel may be no more than a pry bar, or a CNC a glorified jigsaw...But to the person who can see the potential creativity these tools present to them, the possibilities are endless...the more you Practise with these tools the more opportunities present themselves.
-------------------- Pat Welter Masterhand Signs and Designs Unity, Saskatchewan.Canada Posts: 1304 | From: Unity, Saskatchewan.Canada | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
Here are 8 photos of one of my relief carvings....starting from the extreme right to the left. Note that as the angle of view changes, the basic relationship of the elements of the scene changes as well.
BTW, Mick, The thousands of relief carvings I have made over the last 35 years were hand carved and they all are sold.......what do you think of that possibility? You just have to want to learn how and practice.
4 more pics in my neet post.
Joe,
Makin Chip$ and Havin Fun!
[ February 21, 2013, 08:21 PM: Message edited by: Joe Cieslowski ]
-------------------- Joe Cieslowski Connecticut Woodcarvers Gallery P.O.Box 368 East Canaan CT 06024 jcieslowski@snet.net 860-824-0883 Posts: 2345 | From: East Canaan CT 06024 | Registered: Nov 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yes the CNC Machine is just a Tool, much the same way as the Digital Printer is to Sign Painters, Good Design is Paramount in any sign, But Speed is also a factor, you have to be able to get it done Fairly quick now a days, Same way as just about any product, assembly lines and Robots for Cars, Automation in Home Building, convection Ovens in Restaurants, People just want signs in General, quicker... some want it cheaper, I just send those on, and I try to educate on Service, Quality, and Value... and it does work! But I am still impressed by the old ways, that's why I love to Pinstripe and Airbrush....It does fill the void left by the Digital Age.
-------------------- "Keep Positive"
SIGNS1st. Neil Butler Paradise, NF Posts: 6277 | From: St. John's NF Canada | Registered: Mar 1999
| IP: Logged |
In the 80's I had a customer/business for whom I made Xmas gifts for them to give to their best customers. This was all pre/CNC. These took about 30 hrs total and the $$$ paid for my heating oil for the season. When I said thousands, I wasn't kidding.
I studied and taught manufacturing and I brought all of that (like Neal said) to make my business a success.
Joe,
Makin Chip$ and Havin Fun!
-------------------- Joe Cieslowski Connecticut Woodcarvers Gallery P.O.Box 368 East Canaan CT 06024 jcieslowski@snet.net 860-824-0883 Posts: 2345 | From: East Canaan CT 06024 | Registered: Nov 2001
| IP: Logged |
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Group Hug]](graemlins/grouphug.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic