posted
One or two posts lately have mentioned how brushes spend more time in the sign kit than actually being used for work. Got me wondering, how many of you get the opportunity to work with the brush? Ian Stewart-Koster mentioned that brush prices would probably begin to rise as the demand for them declines. Gulp, I have only got a few brushes, 6 for water based, 6 for oil based, one pinstriper (I'm ashamed to say I haven't learnt how to use yet) and a couple that are exclusively for gilding.
I get to use my brushes for work possibly 6 or 7 times a year. Then I get them all going at an annual Letterheads meet.
What about you?
-------------------- Anne McDonald 17 Karnak Crescent Russley Christchurch 8042 New Zealand
"I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure" Posts: 877 | From: Christchurch | Registered: Sep 2006
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I use brushes EVERY day! In fact most of my business is brush work.
I have LOTS of brushes.
Actually most of them are Hadyn Brushes made in Christchurch, New Zealand, your home town Anne!
Last time I was in New Zealand at your Letterhead meet I brought $600 worth of Hadyns from one of your local Sign Suppliers. Freaked her out when I said "One of those means the card full ... not one brush"
I buy the 1" 3/4" 1/2" Hadyn Trucks by the dozen and wear them out! Unfortunately the Poster Paint I use on windows and rough blackboards chews them up. But still very profitable ... I probably get $3000 worth finished work out of a $30 brush!
I do have seperate sets of brushes for diferent mediums ... ink, enamel, acrylic and poster paints in that order. I downgrade a brush to the next medium as it wears out.
They then get relegated to large coffee tins, as I don't have the heart to throw them away!
-------------------- Brian the Brush brian the brush uk Yorkshire, UK www.brianthebrushuk.com Posts: 123 | From: United Kingdom | Registered: Sep 2001
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I've got hundreds of brushes. I'm ashamed to say they mostly sit idle these days. Mostly Langnickels...quills, fitches, stripers. I've also got a very beautiful custom set that my mentor left me when he passed away. It's hard to justify a hand painted sign, when vinyl will last twice as long...
-------------------- Terry Baird Baird Signs 3484 West Lake Rd. Canandaigua, NY 14424 Posts: 790 | From: Canandaigua, New York | Registered: Dec 2002
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I use them every chance I get, usually several times a week. There are still some things you can't do with vinyl, and some little accents here and there always help.
I agree/disagree with you, Terry. I know paints have gone down in quality, but there are also a lot of quality issues between brands/colors of vinyl. I've got 2 customers now that I'm re-doing vinyl that is less than a year old.
I came into this business using a brush, before vinyl. I'll continue to use a brush until I can no longer hold one. If I had to do vinyl only, I'd be in another business.
-------------------- Dale Feicke Grafix 714 East St. Mendenhall, MS 39114
"I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me." Posts: 2963 | From: Mendenhall, MS | Registered: Apr 1999
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Either I've been blessed or lucky to find paint that still has lead in it. I also make it a point not to thin the paint but to add things which will not ruin its opacity which is one reason why paint fails to outlast v v v vinyl in most cases.
Brushes, I have lots of them too and at least monthly pet the ones I haven't used to often. I can go out for a drive and view hundreds of signs from lots of people done in paint which may be faded but than again, what do you expect after being in the weather for twenty or so years. Jerry left me signage, painted, leafed, carved, routed and vinyl which were done in the 80's, most all are inside cept for some which are on painted bus stop seating in the yard with both painted and vinyl lettering and still look good. I guess it all depends on who did them.
-------------------- HotLines Joey Madden - pinstriping since 1952 'Perfection, its what I look for and what I live for'
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We use brushes on 90% of what we do. I guess we are the opposite of most on here, it's our plotter that sits idle most of the time. I only use it when applicable. The profit margin just isn't there for us. I worked a Harley opne house this weekend. Feathers @ $50 a pop, ten minutes at the most and that's including talking to the customer on where they want it placed, etc. Material.....to small to compute, no more than a buck. ( thanks go out to Monte for showing me Mike Lavalle's method )
On the subject of Haydn's. I bought a couple at Duckie's meet. The best flats I've used in thirty five years!!!
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
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We have a ton of brushes in our shop and use them on pretty much every project we do. I suspect that won't change anytime soon in Yarrow...
-grampa dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8738 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
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All I've got is Haydn brushes. They are really good and will last forever if looked after well.
Jon, can I come work for you
We had a guy come in a couple weeks back who can only signwrite with a brush, he's never learned the vinyl side. He can't get a full time job anywhere. It's really sad. There are some good contractors here who only airbrush and paint but in such a small country there's only so much work to go around.
I want to get some truck brushes, they're my next buy. My largest brush at the moment is a 10. Luckily there are plenty of truck brushes here I can borrow.
-------------------- Anne McDonald 17 Karnak Crescent Russley Christchurch 8042 New Zealand
"I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure" Posts: 877 | From: Christchurch | Registered: Sep 2006
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I ordered some more Haydns in early April from a supplier here who lists them in their catalogue- each month they'd phone up "Do you still want those brushes?" "Yes, please..."
They arrived last week, after a four month wait.
I tend to balance profit margins with current workload, when deciding whether to use vinyl or paint- and vinylmask is the most used vinyl here. I'm doing a lot more with urethanes though.
I did speak with one of the major paint makers here (an aussie 'equivalent' of one shot) asking why they've consolidated their colours & why they're harder to get, and the answer was that the digital print market had grown so much, that the general Australia-wide demand from signwriters for their kind of paint had gone from a good flow, circa 1990, to barely a drip nowadays.
They branched out into housepaint instead, as there's a giant market there, but as for us signies, we're pretty insignificant now, unfortunately.
I wouldn't want to have to replace our brush collection- it's like Jon's without as many Haydns- long, medium & short lengths, in various sizes, for enamels, ditto for waterbased stuff, a small bunch for lacquers, and a collection of cheap junky ones for those rough surfaces. Striping brushes, I couldn't guess how many...some have a fond history: one of the most useful broadliners was sold to me by the fellow who bought it just before world war 2 started. He was concerned that German brushes would cease to become available.
Anne, those bigger Haydns are great truck brushes!
[ August 18, 2008, 07:34 PM: Message edited by: Ian Stewart-Koster ]
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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I spent about 6 hrs. lettering showcards today... 5 24 x 32" Boxing matches was the subject...i.m working on a tv series...REAPER, these are for the upcoming episode(see it next season) anyway, had all my sables there, using Richart paints...used one that i started with in 1963...nothing like a sable!! and last week, did a sign w/1shot for a local museum, used one of the sables Wayne Osborne got for me when there in '03, oh my, it worked like a Charm!! and yes, you gotta talk with your brushes...they're Family, right? j
-------------------- John Lennig / Big Top Sign Arts 5668 Ewart Street, Burnaby, British Columbia, Canada bigtopya@hotmail.com 604.451.0006 Posts: 2184 | From: Burnaby, British Columbia,Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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My brushes used to be my bread n' butter tools, now they sit in the darkness of a Signkit that only gets opened every 3 months or so. I could've taken that kit and roamed the world at one time. Actually I still do alot of brush work, but the kind used for "window promos", synthetics, not the same as getting personal with a quill. I must be out of the loop because I never heard of Haydns. Also I have seen a couple of Feather demo's in the past, but have yet to paint one, but now all of a sudden I want to.
-------------------- Rich Stebbing RichSigns Rohnert Park CA 707-795-5588 Posts: 755 | From: Rohnert Park, CA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I easily have a couple hundred brushes in various states of life...I don't use them near as much as I'd like too...some I've inherited that are over 75 years old for sure some maybe even pushing the century mark, but no matter what... once a year whether they need it or not they all have a "coming out" party and they all get cleaned then lovingly get put back away.
I actually think sometimes the brushes are the one thing that keeps me going in this trade that has changed so much...they keep me in touch with my youth...each one has its own story and so far I still remember them all.
I even dreamed once that I died and went to a place where all there was were sign painters...still not sure if that was heaven or hell...altho since there were no customers so I supect it may have been the better of the two!
-------------------- "Werks fer me...it'll werk fer you"
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It makes me sad that i was born too late to live a life with a brush permanently attached to my hand!! It's a really special thing to actually want to do your "work" outside of work for fun!!
Any Heads attending the Cowra meet who'd like some Haydn brushes, let me know. We deal with a company here in Christchurch called Signwriters Supplies who stock Haydn brushes. I'd be happy to save you the freight costs and bring brushes with me in my luggage. I could even ask the rep to call into work.
-------------------- Anne McDonald 17 Karnak Crescent Russley Christchurch 8042 New Zealand
"I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure" Posts: 877 | From: Christchurch | Registered: Sep 2006
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Thanks, Anne, I appreciate that- I'll work out a couple & email you!
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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90% lettering with brushes .. both water and enamal....window splash ..mainly .... and yes not alot of work .. a little tougher to get supplys when needed easly
quote:We had a guy come in a couple weeks back who can only signwrite with a brush, he's never learned the vinyl side. He can't get a full time job anywhere. It's really sad.
shows the state of the sign industry when a tradesman who can paint signs but can not get a job because he can't use a computer.
-------------------- Mark Stokes Mark Stokes Signs Mount Barker South Australia Posts: 388 | From: Mount Barker | Registered: Jan 2005
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It is a sad sign of the industry Mark, you're right.
I've found that for me personally working with a brush is leaning more towards an art form, creating signs that are artworks for someones wall. Finding the spare time to develop that idea is the next task!! I'm working on improving my skills to make it a reality.
My boss and two others at work are fully qualified tradesmen. I'm really grateful to have been given the opportunity to work with them on jobs and learn as I go. I can paint pretty much anything with a pounce pattern and I have been allowed to staple paper to the back wall and play on freestyle stuff. What i really miss is someone giving me guidance on HOW. that's what I love about Letterheads Meets.
I particularly love gilding on glass, a passion inspired by John & Paul Jordan. If I become a multi-millionaire by some incredible stroke of good fortune I'm going to travel the world invading the workshops of everyone on here!!!!!
-------------------- Anne McDonald 17 Karnak Crescent Russley Christchurch 8042 New Zealand
"I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure" Posts: 877 | From: Christchurch | Registered: Sep 2006
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