The Letterville BullBoard: sign on outdoor wall--in the winter?

This is topic sign on outdoor wall--in the winter? in forum Old Archives at The Letterville BullBoard.

To visit this topic, use this URL:
http://www.letterville.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/13/1104.html

Posted by Gailforce (Member # 152) on :

i'm about to break down the job and do an estimate for a guy. wants a sign painted on an old stucoo wall outside his shop.

it rains here alot. i'm leaning toward saying i can't do it til spring.

how many dry days before and after would you want before painting with a water-based sign enamel.

he has to pressure wash the wall before i paint as well.

------------------
free to paint, day and night :)
Gailforce Airbrush & Design
Squamish, BC, Canada
www.gailforce.homestead.com

Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :

Of the several reasons I don't use Waterbase paints,"It rains a lot here" would be one of them!
You would do better with the oilbased paint.
Unless you are Sniffing the fumes directly from the can,working outside on a wall should not raise any health concerns(save falling off the ladder)

------------------
PKing is
Pat King of
King Sign Design in
McCalla,Alabama
The Professor of
SIGNOLOGY

Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :

Hi Gail. I'd recommend waiting until Spring, and using the oil-based paints or whatever you're most comfortable working with. That way you will have confidence in what you're doing, and not be plagued by any lingering doubts as to the performance or durability of the paints that you choose to use.

Do the job now with materials that you're not familiar or comfortable with, and you'll probably live to regret that decision, with potential call-backs and patches which can quickly sour you on a job. I'd much rather see you do the very best job that you're capable of, with the client satisfied, and yourself promptly paid. This will give you a much greater sense of pride and accomplishment in what you've done.

Your choice, but to make that decision, weigh both the positives, and the negatives, before actually committing yourself to the project.

I hope this helps you.

------------------
Ken Henry
Henry & Henry Signs
London, Ontario Canada
(519) 439-1881
e-mail kjmlhenry@home.

Some days you get to be the dog....other days, you get to be the fire hydrant.

Posted by Don Hulsey (Member # 128) on :

Hi Gail,

I have a similar job that I bid last July. They called to accept it the second week of October. I told them I would have to adjust the completion date. On the proposal I stated completion would be 4 weeks from acceptance. The new completion date is June 30, 2001. This job requires a man lift being driven across the front yard, and even if it warms up the ground will be too soft to get on for a while. I have already completed one walla month ago, but we have not been above 25 degrees here for 18 days. Today we started the thaw, now I'm waiting for ground to dry.

As for paint... Latex house paints (high quality) will hold up just fine on stucco. In your case, I would actually recomend them. Latex will dry quicker than oil(still 3 to 4 hours before rain is good) Latex also dries better in cold temps. Oil base paint will NOT dry properly below 50 degrees. Sherwin-Williams has a Low-Temp latex that they will stand behind at 35 degrees(and I applied it over frost one time about 8 years ago, and it's still there).

All this rambling probably did not help at all, but I tried.

------------------
Don Hulsey
Strokes by DON signs
Utica, KY
270-275-9552
sbdsigns@aol.com

I've always been crazy... but it's kept me from going insane.

Posted by Kathy Joiner (Member # 1814) on :

I tend to also agree with Don. I live in Louisiana and even when it is not raining the humidity very high. I find that oil based paint do not want to dry in damp weather. I used exterior latex enamel on murals on 3 cinderblock walls 3 years ago and it looks great. I did most of the painting at night. Good luck.

Kathy

------------------
Kathy Joiner
River Road Graphics
Ponchatoula, La.
Old enough to know better...Too young to resist.

Posted by Adrienne Pereira (Member # 1046) on :

Don't git yur knickers ina twist Duckie...but Dan Sawatzky uses Latex on outdoor walls all the time, it holds up longer too!

Just what I've heard...
Adrienne

------------------
Adrienne Morgan
Splash Signs
www.splashsigns.com
"Rainkatt'

Benicia, CA
707-746-7847 (shop)
707-550-4553 (voicemail)
adrienne@splashsigns.com

Posted by tony ricardo (Member # 578) on :

I'd be inclined to go with the latex also, even though enamels are what I use most of the time on walls . Have you given any thought to putting up a tarp- like a lean-to against the wall to protect from the rain? Just a thought.....Hope it goes well.

------------------
...whatever you do, do it heartily, as unto the Lord and not to men, knowing that from the Lord you will receive the reward of the inheritance..

Ricardo Designs
Jacksonville, Florida
tr4designs@aol.com

Posted by Dan Sawatzky (Member # 88) on :

I hear folks use both oils and acrylics. In my opinion and experience acrylic/latex is the best on stucco/cement based walls.

As long as it isn't freezing it should dry ok although it will take much longer in the damp. You could tarp the wall and use a construction heater to dry/warm things up a little. If the wall faces the south it will warm up better as well.

If all else fails read the label on the can to see what the manufacturer recommends. Show it to the client and aske them to cover the time you waste or extra expenses you incur if you do it before the proper season.

Try to get the client to wait a while if you can. Spring is coming

It isn't any fun painting in the cold or watching your paint run down off the wall in a shower.

(been there done that.)
Good Luck!

Oh yeah I like to use General Paint. Use the premuim grade. It should be available in your area.

-dan

------------------
Dan Sawatzky
Sawatzky's Imagination Corporation
Cultus Lake , British Columbia
dan@imaginationcorporation.ca

www.imaginationcorporation.ca www.giggleridge.com

"Isn't it great to do what you love and love what you do!"

Posted by Linda Silver Eagle (Member # 274) on :

...precisely why I'm doing canvas by the roll, no boards to coat, no windows to scrape, no pressure washing...roll it up to ship it...staple gun and trim it to install...indoors, at my house...no more kerosene heaters, sweat bands around my wrists...14 layers of clothes and I can simultaneously live my life. Just too kewl.

I vote latex!

------------------
Linda Silver Eagle
Silver Eagle Graphix Studio
Georgia, USA

ICQ# 60434646

Signwriters never die...they've always got 1-Shot left!

Posted by Dave Draper (Member # 102) on :

Hi Heads.

I have a window job that I have been putting off because of the cold. When I bid the job it was warm. They stalled and when they gave me the go ahead it was winter.

Well, the contractors around here that work with DRIVIT work through the winter putting that water base concrete mixture on the side of new constrction...and they build an entire scaffold tent ( with huge clear or white plastic sheeting (bisquene) and run heating in with KI fueled space heaters.

Well, that costs money for that set up and it wasn't in the bid, so I wait for a very warm day.

Acrylic Latex is my choice also. ( a good one) not some cheap knock off!

------------------
Draper The Signmaker
Bloomington Illinois USA
Stop in and visit a while!
309-828-7110
signman@davesworld.net
Raptorman or Draper_Dave on mIRC chat

Posted by Brad Farha (Member # 931) on :

Personally, I am more comfortable using oils. But in this case, I think an acrylic is the logical choice. If you do it before the weather is ideal, just make sure the customer pays for the additional measures you'll have to take to do the job right. It can certainly be done.

------------------
Brad Farha, owner
Farha Signs
Beckley, WV
304-252-3778
farhasigns@citynet.net

Posted by Deb Fowler (Member # 1039) on :

I'm glad you guys brought the subject up about the customer being responsible for the off-season inconvenience!
Now, that is something we, as signfolks, don't always hear about much, or foresee when we are estimating a job.
Better include something in my contract(for extra hassle) on outdoor signage ahead of time, I guess.
(Also when I lived in Florida it was a monsoon (lotsa rain) for a couple months and no outdoor painting work. It can be weather-related anywhere. Cold, humidity, dryness, heat....
I think some of the customers know what dragging out the time frame can mean to the job. And then, some don't. Before agreeing on an exterior job,we need to educate them dollarwise ahead of time, and cover ourselves so neither of us loses.
by the way... the tips on the types and brands of paint is a real winner, folks, Thanks!

------------------
Deb
Creative Signs
"All the gold in the world cannot buy a dying man one more breath. So what does that make today worth?" Og Mandino

Posted by Brad Ferguson (Member # 33) on :

There are at least two reasons why latex is a good choice.
First, if there is moisture in the masonry, when it's ready to come out, it will come out. Since oil-based enamel seals the surface, the moisture has to bust through the finish to escape, causing a blister. Latex is porous, like cheese cloth, allowing moisture a way out. Thus, it isn't necessary for the wall to be bone dry before painting.
I know house painters who regularly paint wood siding after a rain. I don't know if it's a good practice or not, but they've said that as long as it's not dripping wet, there's not a problem.

Secondly, the alkali in cement attacks oil-based paint far more readily than it does latex.

I have often lettered brick or stucco with lettering enamels, but latex is a better choice. And for backgrounds and large areas, there is no comparison durability-wise. Latex lasts longer.

------------------
Brad Ferguson
427 S. Sycamore
Ottawa, KS 66067
785-242-9924
signbrad@apip.net

[This message has been edited by Brad Ferguson (edited January 08, 2001).]

Posted by Gailforce (Member # 152) on :

thanks for all the replies. i've been working out of town since i first posted this, so i've been looking forward to getting back here and reading all the replies.

yet again with the guidance of this fine group, i will be able to put together a successful bid and do a perfect job.

------------------
free to paint, day and night :)
Gailforce Airbrush & Design
Squamish, BC, Canada
www.gailforce.homestead.com

UBB.classic™ 6.7.2